Could create a tower with different rules such as
Can only ride mount or
Can only use bombs or
Can only use arrows or
Can only stay in flag room for a set period of time or
In room where flag is, it is obtained by keeping a series of switches pushed down or
Just how about forget flag rooms and make a dungeon with series of bosses you fight with members of guild. And if you make a new tower add a New town that has CTF, addition to scarf quest, new bug, new hat/ mount shop, railroad access, clothing store , vip room, some weird graal shiii that makes no sense and seems kind of satanic.

a tower in the gs room that spawns in the middle of gs

I don't mind having a hat as a reward. Just hoping that towering system gets changed. How about counting individual kills INSIDE a tower. Then you can exchange with a reward when you have a certain amount.

It makes no sense leaving guilds like this. Leaders are abusing noobs and staying inactive for several hours and just get on to check the leaderboard and AFK. And when it comes to a custom hat decision they get to choose a hat and pick 'loyal' members (80% friends). And those 'loyal' members participate in every events, leave to pk blob while noobs are defending towers. I kept an eye on a leader of a tower guild. Just out of curiosity I checked her profile after 3 month. Guess what? she only got 3k kills. While her members got average of 10k kills.

preach on brotha

I think if we had 4 different versions of towering say one per season it would completely save the towering community. For example we could have one season of the current towering system then say for another season a hard point or capture the flag alternative could be put in place of course having a defender/attacker twist to it. I would definitely be inspired to tower more often if they introduced more of a variety to it. This would also tackle the problem of lack of skill required to defend. I explained this horribly but i would definitely prefer it to the current situation.

This is actually... a PHENOMENAL idea.

Seriously, this is one of the best ideas I have ever read on the forums.

This is great

I voted the 'too many' option because most of these towers can just idle for most of the day, but really they should find instead a way to stop guilds from adding and removing members constantly.

The only thing that I can come up with is adding a restriction that stop members of a guild to help their towering guild until they've been in the guild for a certain amount of time (1 week? 1 month?). But if you do something like that then I think you need to start adding more rewards after the 1000 hours achievement so they will continue towering on that tag and not just join another guild.

would b awesome if Guild houses were renamed to Mansion. And if a guild gets a 1000 hour, they get to have a Guild house. In the guild house you can add a statue, flag, some cool decorations as well. Guild house can be accessible to any guild members, even allies.

pretty good suggestion. But adding on to that. I would include certain amount of time with TAG ON + in TOWER HALL or PK Zone. This why, they can't just AFK to get a hat.

http://vinylmationkingdom.com/wp-con...4/09/9JLrr.jpg

Or something like this?

Lol now thats a Castle.

I was thinking of the potential that an area or fort that had random appearance and/or a specific time where you could enter it or leave it... the pic is from aladdin :)

Id also like a tower that could be entered with a certain amount of kills in the 20,000's like sards but a higher amount.

Seems like a decent idea, having a tower where you need # amount of kills and # amount of hours, this would prevent guilds like Arise and BFMD relying on recruiting 523534 noobs whenever they tower. Maybe having the tower time go x1.5 faster than regular tower to make it more competitive for that tower aswell to encourage more guilds to attack it.

Yes! That would be awesome! A tower that you need 20k or at least 10k to enter. PK doesnt reward us with anything, so why not make this type of tower??

20,000 is too much. You might as well just remove some towers, because having a kill amount like this would just completely lower the towering population.

wouldn't that encourage people to boost kills off of alts? :dazed:

Individual kills shouldn't be a factor in towering. It divides guild members rather than allowing guilds to participate in a unified way. If there are limitations, I'd much rather it be directed at the guilds than the individual players. For example, a tower guild members can only access after they've reached 1k hours. Or a tower accessed via a kill count obtained while holding a tower.

Either way, these aren't the questions being asked and I think we're all well aware guilds need to be redone from the bottom-up to address those sort of interests.

Could not have said it better. Especially the 2nd part.

Just add a tower to burger refuge and everyone will be happy or at least somewhat overjoyed

A good idea to incentivize guilds to continue after 1k.

Questionable. Why would a guild take a tower after 1k even if only they and other 1k guilds can take it if they have no interest in hours past 1k?

Perhaps if they are aiming for hours past 1k it will be good, but probably only because it will be an easy tower to hold due to the bottleneck of only allowing 1k guilds.

it should be 5k kills


Hey since were on the subject of towering is anyone here willing to help me start a 1k guild?

you should just bring KOTH back

edit:

i dont even understand why it was removed in the first place. no one liked the concept of KOTH but everyone got used to it in the end and it was suddenly removed. thats how i felt anyway.

Not enough, Graal's playerbase has grown dramatically, yet the amount of forts has been stagnant.

You know what? Forgt what i wrote earlier. I'll leave it up to towerers.

Guess I'm the only one who thinks they should reduce it to be really low, then again that might be a bit hard considering most players in the tower community are noob and the ones who aren't rely on noob recruiting.

all of graal would fight in one area and the lag will break the server

There's not much fort in Graal.

The number of forts we have can not accommodate the number of guilds we have now.
Suggestion: Add 1 more fort and I guess thats enough.

#BringBackKotH2015

The tower system needs to be redone. I think I might have a solution that would make everything more challenging, so that guilds will stop holding hands. I would love to see some actual guild wars.

First off, towers need to be restricted after your guild has a certain number of hours.

I made this:

Tower name/# of guild's total tower hours allowed until restriction/Reason

Sardon's Tower/0-5 hours/Super easy to defend, lots of blocking, spawn is at flag.

Deadwood Tower/0-25 hours/Easy to defend, hp is pretty low, a lot of levels, somewhat amount of blocking, spawn 1 level below flag.

Snow Tower/0-50 hours/Somewhat easy to defend, big open spaces to get to flag, spawn is at flag, lantern or draisine needed for access to snowtown.

York Tower/0-100 hours/Somewhat easy to defend, flag hp is pretty low, somewhat amount of blocking, spawn is next to flag.

MoD Tower/0-250 hours/Somewhat hard to defend, only 2 levels, somewhat amount of blocking, flag room is somewhat big, spawn is 1 level below flag.

Swamp Tower/0-500 hours/Somewhat hard to defend, somewhat amount of blocking, flag room is big, spawn is 1 level below flag somewhat far.

Castle/0-1000+/Lots of open space for guild wars, almost no blocking(if stairs were fixed then no blocking), spawn is 1 level below flag room somewhat far, right next to Graal City.

This system would help new guilds gain hours fast early by only giving them the access to towers that are easy to defend, but then difficulty would begin to rise as you gain more hours. Castle would pretty much become the sweet spot for Towering, since any guild would be allowed to take it, and there is a lot of space for guilds(that want to just ally each other) to fight each other in there. Imagine at least 5 huge guilds(with each having ally guilds making 200+ people) attacking the same tower at once, due to the fact that it's the only tower the guilds are allowed to take. Would be some crazy stuff, and 1k would take a lot of effort and not just afking.

I used to take towers solo. Now I only see players blocking the way and giving us no chance.
I chose more towers!

MoD is easier to take than castle.

Also, limiting the hours a guild can hold just leads to more pointless manipulation of the guild system. Don't you think we already have enough of that in Graal?

MoD is not big enough for a ton of guilds to be in. Did you bother to read? Limiting the hours a guild has to be able to hold that certain fort is what the hours are for. They are a restriction so that guilds above the certain amount of hours are not allowed to take that tower.

Based on this system, if I started a new guild I could take any tower, but once my guild reaches 5 hours we wouldn't be allowed to take sards, 25 = no more deadwood, etc. It wouldn't matter where I tower I could start off in castle if I wanted to, once a guild has a certain amount of hours they can't take certain towers.

This system makes it so that new players who have absolutely no experience towering can make guilds with their friends, and start towering together, since tough guilds won't get in their way from the start. Later on though when guilds start progressing and gaining more hours then the competition becomes tougher. This would make the guilds who hold truces so they can easily get a 1k hat, have to go all out in Castle.

I felt like I needed to explain what I previously wrote more thoroughly, but I figured people were going to understand what I posted, guess not. I hope this clears some of it up.

I think that would make sense. It prevents 'monopoly' guilds from taking everything. With this system younger guilds would be able to develop without being crushed right away, and the more powerful guilds would still have the ability to take more powerful towers and receive the competition from rivaling guilds.

There ya' go. Just logged in to for a few new references.

Guilds like BFM... what are they on their 3rd? Geez...
Guilds like bfm, deceive, elysium, maphasy, epidemic, and 1789 would all have to fight in Castle if they want to gain hours.
Guilds like agoy, nbk, addicted, and towers inc would have to fight in Swamp or Castle.

The best alternative I had ever come up with was to have discrete games where a flag is held for a specified period of time by a specific guild before that guild gets a win and a new round starts. I may have implemented this at one point, but the server didn't really have the population to sustain guild towers as active points of interest.

Essentially you would need to find someway to support variable-schedule reinforcement for towering guilds, which is pretty much the video game psychology equivalent of crack so long as there's maintained interest in towering (shouldn't really be a problem these days). Winning a round provides a schedule of reinforcement. Killing another player, being avenged, etc. also adds to the schedule of reinforcement. Dominating the same tower (or being dominated by someone else at the same tower) for a gazillion hours, on the other hand, doesn't really provide the same kind of gaming high, and will result in burnouts.

Get on graal, tap/click on your map. You will see the same guilds holding the same towers, so your 'burnout' theory might not check out.

I don't know about you, but I used to lead a very small guild and we would take Castle from SoN a lot throughout the day and force them to nub recruit, and their sub leads would get scolded by the leader. We would only take castle, since we wanted to fight that guild.

If the same guilds are holding all the forts then there's probably a burn out of people trying to take the forts from them.

See: No "kingmaker effect"

This is by far the dumbest idea I have ever heard. 0/10






Disclaimer: Joking I actually think this is a great idea. I really felt that the only way the towering system would be improved would be by re-doing the guild system like the dust man said, but this might actually work. Gives noob guilds a chance(well a realistic chance) to get into the towering business and it forces all those adult filled guilds to actually compete for towers. The only thing I would say is to add another tower for the 1k plus guilds.

Please refer to my comment about the kingmaker effect.

Yes, I see what you mean. Now the question is why is that happening and can it be fixed. Is it the players fault or is the system setting them up for failure.

There are plenty of games where it isn't a problem, which makes this a systemic issue. I think that article provides a good ideal to aim for. Mind you, the article is in a magazine about board games, board games have thousands of years more history to learn from than MMOs, and that existing research done on board games has been used to show why some MMOs succeed and others fail.

redacted

Those are excellent ideas to reward the guild as opposed to the individual players. Not sure if its feasible but maybe the points can also be used to add rooms to guildhalls, increase the maximum number of members allowed in 'high level' guilds. This will defo make the game more enjoyable in all aspects. Especially towering, this is in direct contrast to seeing the same 15 goons changing tags like clothes to get new hats.

It sounds like a major overhaul of the system though but would be worth it if it can be implemented.

I see what you mean, but I wasn't saying it was a better solution than redoing the guild system. I was just acknowledging that there was another way it could possibly be fixed.


If you, rufus, or fp4 could do this the players would idolize you even more. I think the majority of the competitive community would love it if this happened, but is it possible. Would Xor or whoever makes the final call allow this(im guessing it would put a limit on joined guilds or else it would be back to the same problem). This wouldn't just improve the towering system, it would probably make guild spar better too. I've said it before when players complain, even if someone is willing to work on something it doesn't mean it would be approved by management/ownership.


I talk a lot of crap about pc graal, but the one thing I liked about it was the guild loyalty that players showed. If what you mentioned above would come to fruition it would make classic much better.

Now you aren't talking about just the tower system... some of your points seem good, but could be abused like the heal/attack flag one.

Maybe if a guild shop were to be added where you can buy things like furniture for guild's house, 5+ member expansion slots, guild hat tokens, guild shield tokens, guild house room expansions.

Sure you could add more events, but in the end I feel as if the events will end up being "Guild Chance", not sure why...

If rewarding a guild based on points then the system would have to be done in a way that guilds can't help each other out, which is what I posted earlier. If you add things like taking the tower for points, then I can see guilds letting friendly guilds take and then they let them take it, and repeat... not a good system.

The hour system is fine how it is, you can use hours as milestones to unlock rewards as you gain tower hours. Maybe even milestones like holding 2 towers, holding 3, 4, etc could unlock certain rewards, instead of just making the guild look like a huge monster with a lot of people on.

Example of milestones: (rewards need to be done based on a much more friendly difficulty so that guilds can progress quick at first, then work harder later on)

Reach 10 hours: Your guild has gained a guild house. 10 hours is good, because some guilds don't like to tower and are just family based.

Reach 50 hours: Your guild has gained a +5 member expansion, enjoy!

Reach 100 hours: Your guild gained a shield token.

Reach 500 hours: Your guild has gained a guild house room expansion, enjoy!

Reach 1000 hours: Congratulations! Your guild has received a hat token, Good Job!

Every 1000 hours from this point on can be a guild house room expansion slot.

5k: another hat token

10k: mount token

I do like your idea about the guild having to be on tag to wear the hat though, that would make guilds more loyal. And you would feel kind of obligated to stay in that guild forever, since if you care about the hat, then you wouldn't leave.

Sounds good, when's it happening XD

Sadly, sometimes the people that have the best ideas and want to help the game grow aren't the ones calling the shots. Would be nice if ideas could be shouted out in the game, and people could vote for them in the game.

The fundamental issue is the kingmaker effect. Guild towers are isolated enough that devs can experiment. I understand the time issue, but towering is pretty much one of the core selling points of Graal in the present time, i.e. a major gameplay feature. I would personally seek to experiment on MoD for any changes. I would also ignore verbal feedback that doesn't align with overall participation in towering.