That's awful but I have lost a few spars in mixed spar room because I live near server and have one of the lowest pings and end up killing them too but it instantly declares them as winner because my hit doesn't process clientside for them until after their delay.

Which is exactly one of the reasons we have Admins as eyes/refs to make the decisions that the scripts really aren't accurate with.

yes yes exactly. i want to show that on a video about how delay mechanism works. but it's not easy as it seems.

look what i just found lol







if we can have our screen locked during the gst. it'd be cool to watch the screens side by side.
btw chun if u want a full version bandicam.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5c...ew?usp=sharing
ur welcome

how am i a troll for stating straight facts in this thread lol
sorry if the truth hurts your feelings

@Comyt

I hope you and your team are proud of your performance.

Congratulations on being last seasons GST winner and this seasons Unofficial Winner, according to many respectable opinions.

If it said "your guild has won the spar" for rebellious players then they won...
Congrats on the win reb

Threads moving so fast that it won't see that I'm gay!!!

ヽ(͡◕ ͜ʖ ͡◕)ﾉ

I think Leah, Crush and I were the real winners with our great costumes and GST spirit

After reading several posts by different players, I agreed that the time frame for both of their hits were different like Kouji had mentioned. The reason why everyone saw Kouji's hit was because he actually did hit Domi first, and then on Domi's screen, he hit Kouji because he wasn't dead yet(but during this whole time, his death gani had already happened on our screen). And that's the reason why we couldn't see his sword at the end because their frames were different. I'm not saying that he has bad delay because I do know that both of them do have a bit of delay but that's just how I understood the situation.

Btw, I saw your post Aaron.

Basically we won lol

The best GST clip of all time.

i actually wasn't on the team and didn't participate since i'm enjoying my time in college, just supporting the true winners here.

True winners? Oh I thought you were supporting Rebellious? Glad you agree it was VIS and not let fail scripts decide outcome when clearly everyone can see both died. =o ehehe

ur a worse troll than Austin Koga lol..so did you purposely ignore Lia's post explaining the situation because you refuse to accept you're wrong?

I read all the posts and heard many opinions which is why I said Rebellious is unofficially the GST champions according to many respectable opinions.

But call me old fashioned, I prefer admins use their eyes (or eye if you're clops) to make their decisions and if they miss it they default to the scripts. Just my opinion.

Lmao, Graal is going to have to start looking at re-plays now, since the players don't trust the staffs' decisions.

"Refs are being bought"
"The FISA is full of corruption"
"Let's watch the replay"
"Graalbusters gonna bring FISA down"
"Someone must have put a lot of money into VIS winning"

*We are now looking at the replays*
*We can see frame by frame that .... made contact first*
*Resume/Winners*

graal staff should record the gst from now on. cause spectator's script isn't helping much.

I just think it's hilarious that you guys don't seem to believe that a computation performed by a machine is 5384758934759346 times less prone to error than some at-glance judgment made by a dude who has sparred maybe 100 times in his life (no offense to the host)

I get that the host probably wasn't paying 100% perfect attention to the last hit, but if it was automated in some way to announce who won the spar then it would have clearly shown that Rebellious won (if it truly did give them the popup saying they won)

Not to mention that the replay clearly shows 1 player dying first
The only time a spar is a tie is when both players die on the same frame... Delay has absolutely nothing to do with it, if either of them delayed then it doesn't matter because 1 of them died before the other, which means that they lost, that's how sparring works in every single arena on iClassic

Both dying doesn't matter? Hmm still sounds like a tie to me. =o

Oh man. that is a BIG offense bro
http://www.graalians.community/forum...1&d=1441599799

Not trying to be mean, but honestly that just kind of supports my initial suspicion that he isn't exactly well-versed in the mechanics of sparring on iClassic or how matches should be judged... I'm sure he did his best though, because I don't think it announces which team won (like it does in the Battle Arena). I wouldn't really blame him, I'd blame the fact that it doesn't tell him who won.

The problem is, these "fail scripts" have been deciding the outcomes of single spars and guild spars since forever.

Still not on either side of the argument. I still dont care.

Aguzo ._.
Edit: Lertcon was actually really nice, and he was calm/understanding in all of the rounds regardless of what other people on the forum was saying about him in the past few pages. He didn't argue with anyone when they were basically yelling in his face in the Finals room lol.

What does it mean if 2 people don't "die on the same frame"?
You can kill people after you're dead?
Seems like something the laggier player would do.
Laggers look like they die last, but Graal scripts determine them the winner.

I'm pretty sure they have some sort of tool that tells them who won. But he wasn't paying full attention to the match to notice a player dying before the other. VIS players saw the pop up saying "you lost the spar" and desperately stood next to him saying "tie" to see if he gave them a redo and he did lol

Wasn't directed towards you or anyone else. I was actually being honest about that post, since in futbol the ref's decision is usually final.

Meanwhile in football, and baseball they watch the replays in tough situations.

For these type of issues to not arise, maybe a real-time viewer should be added, instead of the choppy one. Also, staff should have some sort of monitor to watch replays for the "what just happened?" moments.

Even if Kouji was the laggier player, it wouldn't matter. If you are 0.5 vs. 0.5 against Sarah and she's using 3G, if she dies first then you are the shown as the winner 100% of the time.
No one can show a single example of a player dying second and being declared the winner or anyone dying first and being declared the loser. That's not how any script in the arena works. It doesn't make human errors like that. Domi clearly died first in that replay, and hit detection is verified serverside so I'm sure it told VIS members that they lost the spar.

http://puu.sh/k2GYt/03e72c6400.png
That kind of makes it pretty clear...

I don't have anything for or against either team, but Rebellious won based on that replay and the server seems to agree with that if they're telling the truth about receiving the popup. It's not as if it's going to be a reversed decision though, but just putting it out there. Lertcon probably isn't to blame. I don't fault him for not being able to judge it accurately, but it should be automated so that he doesn't need to.

Human error? You've never seen laggers walking around after they're dead on Graal? You must be the only one there. An analytical person like you also has seen many instances of a laggier person being sliced, walking around for a second, hitting the other player, then dying after their opponent.

In a spar room we have no option but to go by who the script determines as a winner. GST though has a precedent of hosts restarting matches at their discretion.

I can't believe that you all are arguing over who won this spar when it's too obvious.
What is done is done and I'm glad VIS won the GST they did a hard work in it unlike Rebellious.

Show me a recorded example of a player dying first in a spar and it being declared a tie or a win in their favor
Until then, there's really nothing else I can say from my side that hasn't already been said

When your hit registers on a player at 0.5, no matter what their ping is, the death animation starts
Two players can hit each other simultaneously, with one registering first, due to several circumstances
The player that dies first loses
If they die at the same time, it's a tie

If this GST went by the same system that they use in every single other spar in the game, then Rebellious would have been declared the winner
It didn't, so VIS was declared the winner

3 Cheers for VIS, Deity, and Lertcon!

Hip hip hooray! ^^

Because rebellious got an easy bracket?? Lol rebellious is one of the few guilds that consistently get far and do well in gst, easy bracket or not.

VIS won and thats the end result, shouldn't be complaining about that. That being said, the admins need to look into the guild sparring mechanics so that there is no mistakes or complications like this.

I recall an admin asking us "who won that round?" Admins obviously don't watch half the spars, they should have a notification pop up for who won or a live scoreboard of the current spar for the viewers.

Reb has placed top 4 in 3/4 of the last GST's, better than any other guild in consistency.

easy bracket or not the finals against VIS was one we had handled and should of won but due to the match that got considered a tie even though it was Reb's win.

please make it the pop up notification you get whenever you win spars in idevice or mixed spar rooms, that way they have to see it

Are you saying you've never seen a lagger get slashed, but have a delay before they take damage, or are you saying you won't admit it until someone posts a video of that happening? There's even delay in the video you posted.

Man, it's in plain English: "Show me a recorded example of a player dying first in a spar and it being declared a tie or a win in their favor"
Don't waste your time, you'll never be able to show me that because it's impossible because the script does not work that way

I think the convo is over by now though, GJ to Rebellious and VIS

Its just a gst

Reb was like #40 on the leaderboard, not sure why this spazz is complaining we had an easy bracket like we cheated lol

We were or atleast I was expecting a hard bracket for being so low on ldrboard lol. Can't blame us for having an easy bracket, it's not like we can choose lol

I was going to rep you instead, but I must spread :\



Congratulations OG for creating the GST thread with the most replies and the most views.


Keep clicking boys only 2 spar threads with higher views and one with higher replies.







How about Yui and the ultimate choke on her guilds elimination match? Woot woot full health

lol I think she's just mad cause 7mood let her team down by constantly lagging out.

Shes happier than the poeple who have won gst. However 7mood has never played a hall gst without freezing or disconnected. Mood also kept d/c for some reasons which is when sarahs team were 4vs5 offline they have won it :blush: its an honor for me to See matches like that. Im sure your the one who is mad not her :D

Congrat abod on ur frst forum post!!!!1!1!

if anyone is mad it's saber since u got his main account banned by being on it during gst XD GG u suk Lina

Ye know, I believe I finally found the answer to why I never participated in a GST. There are obviously so many problems, and I see many people are very regretful and angry about it.

Naa the loudest ones always get the most attention. Most people who participated in GST, including myself, thoroughly enjoyed it.

u better pray for rebellious buddy. sarah and abood will only target one guild for next 3 months.

Is this what you mean?


This is me vs Shiden from a while ago, I included the full match and a frame by frame version at the end of the video. As the slowed down part shows, I swung first, died first and it was declared a tie. (I'm from Toronto, Canada and average about 110ms)

The frame by frame version shows that:

• He swings his sword
• I go in and attack him while his sword is inactive (since the sword only does damage on the first frame)
• He reactivates his sword's hitbox (swings again)
• I die and my death animation starts
• Right when I get warped out, his health goes down to zero and his death animation starts while he's still in the arena (you can see the 0 over his head)
• He gets warped out and the tie message pops up

This is what I don't get, if the server saw me die and warped me out first then why did it still tie?

No clue what you are talking about lol ... I simply wasn't able to be online for gst since I had some stuff to do
http://i61.tinypic.com/2a5c28z.jpg

That's super awkward to me and from a scripting perspective and I don't understand how or why it would work that way. From my understanding of how hit detection works on iClassic:

• You swing sword on your client
• Data is sent to the server telling it that you swung your sword
• Opponent receives data from server telling them that you swung your sword
• Your sword swings on opponent's client
• If they are hit on their client, they take damage

It's clientside with serverside validation (I think). fp4 or Dusty would probably be the only ones able to 100% clarify how or why that spar went the way it did, but my assumption is that there is a very brief pause in the script before determining the winner (which allows for a longer tie period).

If that's true, then I was incorrect and in cases where one of the players delays (like Shiden) delayed ties can happen. That apparently still isn't what happened in VIS vs. Rebellious though, since the one side was told that they won (because neither Kouji or Domi delay). Thanks for posting video.

Yui had 3.0 vs fro at 0.5 and nf at 1.0.
She got nervous and rushed.