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-   GraalOnline Classic (https://www.graalians.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=12)
-   -   What type of system would you want for spar? (https://www.graalians.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29393)

Aguzo 06-18-2015 02:27 AM
Quote:
Posted by Zetectic (Post 581046)
easy fix. you won't lose any points below diamond tier for being inactive. so you will be at gold if you aren't going to spar.
lol this whole concept idk what's it called, but it's all used in Pop tag since 2002.
I'll just keep explaining to people.

Just an example of the following points/rank/penalty/promotion/demotion system
Rank: Range (penalty after 12 hours or not clocking in at least 10 matches) Promotion start/Demotion star once within rank
Bronze: 1-100 (5 points) Getting ranked = 10 matches, P = 101pts
Silver: 101-250 (10 points) P = 251pts, D = 50pts
Gold: 251-500 (25 points) P = 501pts, D = 175pts
Diamond: 501-1000 (50 points) P = 1001pts, D = 500pts
Legendary: 1001+ (100 points) D = 750pts
Quote:
Posted by Zetectic (Post 581046)
to prevent AFK players, make sure players have to press yes before entering
In every ranked game, if you are not ready then that is your own fault. Once you join queue for the server to find you a match, then you are at fault if afk, and people will happily take your points for their prizes.

Zetectic 06-18-2015 02:33 AM
Aguzo, yours sounds too complicated. Sometime after tomorrow I will bring my ideas about the new spar system with some visual images.

Quote:
Posted by Hikaru (Post 581049)
In every ranked game, if you are not ready then that is your own fault. Once you join queue for the server to find you a match, then you are at fault if afk, and people will happily take your points for their prizes.
lol 'oh he said it's instant game, but i had to wait 20 minutes. then i lost b/c i got disconnected for not moving.' hella this is whats exactly gonna happen @ the 1st day. there's gonna be 500 players queuing and you can't blame the longer wait time.
when you find the opponent, theres gotta be an option saying 'yes' and 'no' and add that countdown thingy from the streak room.

Aguzo 06-18-2015 02:37 AM
Quote:
Posted by GOAT (Post 581047)
Still think people would use the system just to get easy wins. Especially if classic decides to bring milestone hats.

Only for active sparers, depending on the requirements to merit a ranking. Any good sparer that just likes to spar a couple times a day would be rank inappropriately.
They can't get easy wins, because if you win enough matches then you will be promoted, and what good would that do? you won't gain anything from getting a ton of wins.

1. Your rank will never get higher by facing easy people.
2. You won't gain any prize pools that actually matter.

No, let's say 4000+ people start using ranked matches for the first time right? Then the higher tiers will be winning more often than lower tier players. If you aren't putting effort into ranking up, then your rank will disappear either way. If they just spar a couple times a day then they should be at least silver-gold (which is fine), if they spar higher tiers in 1 match, and win then they will get even more points.

Quote:
Posted by GOAT (Post 581047)
So pretty much the best ranked bronze player would be below every sparer from the top tiers. Seems to me that this ranking system goes back to the original problem comet mentioned about needing to constantly spar to be on the board.
I don't think the problem was constantly sparring to be on board, I believe it was "anyone can spar a lot, and be high on the board". A tier system would require skill, and you can't camp at the top.

GOAT 06-18-2015 02:38 AM
Quote:
Posted by Zetectic (Post 581053)
Aguzo, yours sounds too complicated. Sometime after tomorrow I will bring my ideas about the new spar system with some visual images.
Don't worry there's still more. They still need to figure out how the gaining and losing of points will work along with how the players ranking will affect those points. The fun part is still to come.

Aguzo 06-18-2015 02:39 AM
Quote:
Posted by Zetectic (Post 581053)
Aguzo, yours sounds too complicated. Sometime after tomorrow I will bring my ideas about the new spar system with some visual images.
Just search league of legends', and clash of clans' ranking systems if you can't understand what I am saying/trying to say in a simple way.

Not entirely sure how elo works in league, but I heard it is similar to clash

Clash: you are in leagues, and depending on how many stars you get against someone else's village you get certain amount of trophies(also based on opponent's town hall level/league)

You need a certain amount of trophies for each league, and rank up/fall according to your trophy count.

You can't "selective spar" against another town hall, but you could get lucky and find an opponent with low defenses/a lot of resources, but you would need to fall down to trophy range of 900-1200 to find inactive town halls with lots of resources in pumps. Other wise the higher your trophy count is, the more active people are, so less gold "less ez wins"

Zetectic 06-18-2015 02:46 AM
Quote:
Posted by Hikaru (Post 581057)
Just search league of legends', and clash of clans' ranking systems if you can't understand what I am saying/trying to say in a simple way.

Not entirely sure how elo works in league, but I heard it is similar to clash

Clash: you are in leagues, and depending on how many stars you get against someone else's village you get certain amount of trophies(also based on opponent's town hall level/league)

You need a certain amount of trophies for each league, and rank up/fall according to your trophy count.
I played Clash of Clans in the past. it was totally abused by players. i saw level 90s with th9 at bronze 1.

Aguzo 06-18-2015 02:51 AM
Quote:
Posted by Zetectic (Post 581059)
I played Clash of Clans in the past. it was totally abused. i see level 90s with th9 at bronze 1.
Yes I know, people camp around that trophy range to farm. But we are talking about wins, not gold. Either way losses are taken out of profiles. So the point is getting your rank up. Total town halls destroyed "total wins" in clash don't really show your skill, whereas your rank/league would.

Besides... who wouldn't want to put in effort to get gralats/hats/hat ticket + belt?
Each tiers prizes are based accordingly to skill level in the op at the bottom

GOAT 06-18-2015 02:57 AM
Quote:
Posted by Hikaru (Post 581054)
I don't think the problem was constantly sparring to be on board, I believe it was "anyone can spar a lot, and be high on the board". A tier system would require skill, and you can't camp at the top.
Quote:
Posted by Comyt (Post 579337)
Change the leaderboard again. The old leaderboard had a few flaws and could be abused. The current leaderboard is even worse and was intended to "increase sparring activity" but that is the opposite of what it is doing. This leaderboard ranks people based on how much they spar for the entire season and pretty much forces someone to throw away a huge chunk of their life to get their name to the top. Nobody wants to do this. Sparring should be a thing you do for fun when you are bored, not something you do as a full-time job. Sarah, who is the current #1 on this leaderboard and has been for the past year or so, does not even like this leaderboard. And I, the #1 on the previous leaderboard for multiple years, do not like that one. We need a wins per day/week/all time leaderboard, just like there is for player killing and baddy killing (which is useless by the way, why do they have a decent leaderboard and sparrers do not?). This would probably accomplish the goal that the current leaderboard came nowhere near accomplishing, and increase overall activity. Instead of throwing away their life for a whole 3 months to get to the top, sparrers can now throw away their life for just a day or a week to get their name on the leaderboard. Also, with this leaderboard, people would start setting goals for themselves, like "I'm going to get 500 wins today" or "I'm going to get 5,000 wins this week" and compete with their peers for the top spot of the day/week. This, instead of "I'm going to get 1,000 points today and still be 30,000 points behind Sarah with my name nowhere near the top of the leaderboard." If this is added, it can also get rid of the ugly iDevice/Facebook split on the leaderboard, since one can't really make the argument "this person is only winning more spars than me because they're on their pc."
Since this thread was a result from comets thread I made the reference to that point.



We can go on and on about this, but the only way of knowing if this will work is by being added. Idea sounded cool at first, but once I discussed it, seems like it will end up with the same problem of having to no-life it to be rank high. A choice has to be made in regards to this ranking system and it's between allowing players to camp at the top or make it so players have to constantly spar to stay on top.

Aguzo 06-18-2015 03:09 AM
Quote:
Posted by GOAT (Post 581064)
Since this thread was a result from comets thread I made the reference to that point.



We can go on and on about this, but the only way of knowing if this will work is by being added. Idea sounded cool at first, but once I discussed it, seems like it will end up with the same problem of having to no-life it to be rank high. A choice has to be made in regards to this ranking system and it's between allowing players to camp at the top or make it so players have to constantly spar to stay on top.
The words you put about comyts quote in bold is basically what my quote was saying. "You have to spar a lot to stay at the top". I fixed that already, by putting prizes as the following and having to spar skilled players to stay at the top/get demoted:

Unixmad would have to add the prizes accordingly to their preferences.
So just an example

Bronze: 100g for top 100 (prize pools cash out resets every hour)
Silver: 500g for top 50 (prize pool resets every 12 hours)
Gold: 1000g for top 25 (prize pool resets every day)
Diamond: 2,500g for top 10 (prize pool resets every week)
Legendary: 10,000g for top 5 (prize pool resets every month
Godlike: #1. Belt and hat ticket. #2. Chooses a hat (made by gfx) #3. Receives only hat left. (resets every season/3 months)

Oh, and sorry to the people that do not understand how I am trying to explain the system. It is new, yes for you, but for other games a lot of people understand it. I might be adding a lot of detail, but they are just potential key points to making it un-abuse-able. Also, if you still have questions or concerns try to either message me about it, before posting, since most of the questions are already answered in op, or post an idea on how to make it better.

For those who have read the op: feel free to post any flaws, and I will try to fix it.

Kendama 06-18-2015 03:15 AM
Too many #'s O.O too complicated for graal

Aguzo 06-18-2015 03:33 AM
Quote:
Posted by Kendama (Post 581071)
Too many #'s O.O too complicated for graal
Yes, I feel like people started to become disoriented when I started talking about the potential points system.

Not sure if it's too hard to multiply the following based on tiers for some, but I'll do it for you :D so no worries.

Let's say you are in silver okay, following me?

You have 3 hearts remaining after you win, so that x 5 = 15 points

2.5 hearts x 5 = class? anyone? "ooo, ooo, i know, i know". "Yes pacboy?" "12.5 points?". "Very good pac, 10 gold stars for you"

2.0 x 5 = 10

1.5 x 5 = 7.5

1.0 x 5 = 5

0.5 x 5 = 2.5

More advanced mathmeticinalimicalness equations (based on lower/higher tiers)

WARNING not for the feint of heart or easily cringe-able.

Tier/league Higher than you replace, 5 with 10. Tier/league lower, replace 5 with 2.5

Fulgore 06-18-2015 03:35 AM
This is all stupidly unnecessary/complex.

Aguzo 06-18-2015 03:37 AM
Quote:
Posted by Fulgore (Post 581073)
This is all stupidly unnecessary/complex.
Honestly, you don't have to understand for it to work. That's the scripter's job. Everyone else can just enjoy, it's basically almost the same as the ratio system that thallen put. Where the system takes the ratio of your opponent and multiplies it by 10, then adds to your score.

Fulgore 06-18-2015 03:47 AM
Quote:
Posted by Hikaru (Post 581076)
Honestly, you don't have to understand for it to work. That's the scripter's job. Everyone else can just enjoy, it's basically almost the same as the ratio system that thallen put. Where the system takes the ratio of your opponent and multiplies it by 10, then adds to your score.
It certainly isn't that I don't understand..though nice subtle stab.

This just is not needed for spar in iClassic right now. As many have already said, there aren't enough people who are on/sparring at once for this to consistently be a good option.

Aguzo 06-18-2015 03:53 AM
Quote:
Posted by Fulgore (Post 581078)
It certainly isn't that I don't understand..though nice subtle stab.

This just is not needed for spar in iClassic right now. As many have already said, there aren't enough people who are on/sparring at once for this to consistently be a good option.
I'm not even attacking you, it was in general... I said you, but meant anyone... don't be so sensitive man.

I look at the votes and it's mostly just alumni republicans not wanting any bills to pass. While the democratic party is trying to please the public.


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