"Guild Chat" Permission
 

Please:
http://puu.sh/aPpzq/85e1c2a95d.jpg

I know it probably looks like I'm trying to make the game antisocial as hell with the in-game chat visibility thing and now this, but I'm pretty sure there is no downside to having this permission added as long as it is checked by default.

"You shouldn't add people to your guild if you don't want to see their chat!"
I agree, but until staff change the way that towering works the meta will include temporary/noob recruits. It 100% shouldn't, but to compete in the current towering format you simply need to do it.

"You can just block them!"
I agree, I'm just trying to save others the headache.

It's just a quality-of-life change that I wouldn't mind seeing and wouldn't be bothered at all if it wasn't added. It would make towering and guild sparring a little more tolerable, for some of us at least.

Will only the leader be able to change it?

I'm pretty sure the way that guilds work in general only allow the leader to change any of these permissions, so yes.

Oh, gosh, sorry, I goofed. x.x I thought there was an "edit members' rights" right, sorry.

What would happen to the person who have no rights to guild chat when they try to chat? An annoying message pops up, saying "You do not have permission to use guild chat"?

The guild chat button simply does not show? Seems the most logical to me.

I dont like this idea using noobs for towering then kicking them is bad enough, Build a decent tower team dont rely on noobs, problem solved

Right, because new players can't enjoy or be helpful at towers?

The "noob recruiting" thing is popular, and always will be popular, because staff refuse to make it illegal in any way. You act like it's entirely a bad thing, when I'm sure there are many new players who actually appreciate the opportunity to tower with a guild.
I've already suggested 100 times in the past that staff add the requirement of only allowing someone who has had a tag for 24 hours to enter a tower, but it's not happening. We deal with it and adjust accordingly.

Not to mention, you shouldn't view this as something negative. I'd have been using it in my tower guilds to remove the guild chat permission from everyone who isn't a leader or a temporary leader, because I personally feel like it'd allow my guild to function better. Then, sometimes, I'd love to guild spar with people but not constantly deal with their spam in guild chat. If it's my guild, shouldn't I be able to control that?

Nope.

A guild is a community. Without communication there is no community. What I would like to see is a greater visibility of guilds.

I disagree completely. Classic is all about the community which guilds pretty much form the entire skeleton of. If a player in your guild is abusing the guild chat then it's up to you to kick them from the guild / deal with it however else you think is best. You agreed that noob recruiting is bad and needs to be dealt with, but such an option as this would only encourage it.

It may increase your "quality of life" as a guild leader (though honestly I have no desire to be a part of a guild where a guild leader would even consider using this) but it only hurts the community as a whole, making it harder for new players to become involved in the community and possibly even turning them away from the game altogether.

How is a new player supposed to enjoy towering when they can't even participate in one of the most important aspects when defending and attacking: communication?

You're basically just using them by recruiting them, telling them to sit somewhere and then making them unable to even talk to anyone in the guild chat. I don't know what your definition of "fun" is, but that definitely is not fun.

This idea LOL!
I kinda support it... but then again theres really no logical purpose. Only guild owners can edit members' powers; if a member is being annoying in guild chat, i would just kick and tell my guild's other leaders not to recruit the certain person again. Basically, my logic is: if a member is being annoying in your guild's guild chat, then there is no reason to keep him in your guild.

What I would like to see is the "Guild Chat Button" option not only hiding the chat box to send guild messages, but also block all guild messages from being received. Very useful if youre having a long PM conversation in the midst of guild spam.

Was gonna say this. Much better alternative imo

This just sounds unfair, its better to stick with kicking or blocking. Then next thing you know
Thallen: Wow who didnt say he was at the flag?
Player: "You can not use guild chat"
Thallen: I bet it was that guy
Player: (Clearly saying NO I swear I was saying FLAG) " You can not use guild chat"

Again, I don't understand why you're narrowing this down to "new players." If your pessimistic example was the case, then why would that player remain in the guild? Why wouldn't they just leave?

I don't understand the notion of not being able to choose what happens to your guild when there is the option to freely choose what guild you want to join. You act as if they are being trapped or forced to do something. I don't follow that at all.

If the leader of the guild would like to disable guild chat, who are you to say that they shouldn't be able to? It's their guild.

You probably haven't played iClassic enough yet to fully understand the functionality and general nature of guilds on this server. There is supposed to be communication, but there's also supposed to be structure.

When you're leading a successful tower guild and you have players (who are very young and understandably immature) sending 30 messages a second and you're trying to coordinate the guild, the current solution is to kick him. Is that really better than taking away their permission to use guild chat? I don't see how.

"I have the option to leave your guild, but you shouldn't have the option to control and tweak your guild to your own liking."
IDK, I don't understand that thought process.

No, it'd be like this:
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Thallen: Hey Livid, you're an active contributor to this guild, but sometimes you're annoying and making it hard for the guild to function when you spam guild chat. Could you please stop?
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Livid: THALLEN PLS GIVE ME HAT
Thallen removes your guild chat permission

So, what's so bad about that?

I think youre using examples that can be dealt with through kicking someone, I mean if someone was going to spam you for the hat they'd probably do it in PMs to not look foolish in front of other guildies.

Perhaps permissions can be enabled that restricts usage of guild chat, e.g. players can only send a message every 2 minutes, but flat - out removing their ability to talk and communicate seems a little cruel lol

Yeah they enjoy towering so much that they're having so much fun they leave. Again, with guild towering you have to be able to communicate with everyone. In the case where no guild is attacking, what is someone with disabled chat going to do? The way I see it, they'll just end up spamming and asking you to allow them to talk in guild chat, and I think you're trying to avoid spam. Nobody is gonna ask for the hat in guild chat 15362782 times, they're going to PM you for the hat 15362782 times.

This is probably the worst idea I have heard in a long time. A guild is a social thing, and you shouldn't take that away from people just because you don't want to hear what they have to say.

i dont really think its about spam. Its more about taking this game to serious and feeling more important than one really is. Pretty much what you get with this change is you get to use poor noobs for your own purpose while not having to communicate with them. Some people feel theyre too important on this game to talk to newbies.

the sad part is that these kids are so desperate to fit in they would let someone do that to them just so they could be part of the guild.

a better option would be an option to ignore guild chat. if youre towering and know what you have to do there's no need for all the spam. It also works with other graal activities in which you want to have your tag on but dont want to hear all the spam.

Add ignore guild chat for an option. That sounds better.

Exactly this

Guilds really suck on iClassic.

Right now it's basically "join my guild so we can take the tower right now," rather than "join my guild and show some loyalty."

There have been talks of a "guild council" that would direct staff on where to head with guild-based updates. Let's just say that if Thallen is on it, the entire game is screwed.

How about they change it so that for the first 10 minutes of joining any new guild, you will not be considered a part of said guild in the event of towering. Meaning, the player would still be in the guild, but if that guild currently has control of a tower, he/she would not be considered a part of the guild as far as the game mechanics are concerned. So this player would not be able to help defend the flag, be immune to sword attacks from other guild members, or respawn in the flag room in the event of death. Just for the first 10 minutes.

That way guilds can't recruit random noobs to help them tower.

As far as the "disable guild chat" button goes, I could see it coming in handy for certain occasions, so why not.

Whats bad is that your asking for an option thats already there: Blocking, kicking, ignoring.

I second this

Its a great idea. Sometimes you didnt want to kick/block the person but just want him to shut up. And if you have a guild drama, that command is so useful to shut everyone up instead of simply kicking everyone which causes even more drama.

I agree. Completely. Guild chat should be a privilege, not a right.

And we could have global chat to serve whatever other potty mouthed fart jokes that the kids would otherwise post in guild chat.

Maybe a 5-10 second cool down between guild chat messages to reduce spam? I personally don't like this idea but I see it working for some people

I get how some people don't like the idea because their theory is "OMG THIS CAN BE ABUSED AND YOU CAN JUST RECRUIT NOOBS AND NOT LET THEM TALK AND THEN THEY ARE YOUR SLAVES," but I don't think you're considering that they have the option of leaving or just not joining your guild

I also suggested that this permission be ticked by default (or worded as "disable guild chat" and unticked), so I just feel like a guild leader should be able to control their guild

I'm fine just not recruiting people who are spammy and crazy, but I feel like this would be cool and might help guilds function during towers and GSTs

I don't think you're considering that you have the option to kick/block them.

If you really aren't using them as your slaves or whatever, then just kick them.

Nah, you're being very narrow-minded about the purpose of this functionality
You're treating it as if it's some "player punishment" feature when it's giving a leader control and and order over their guild (which they should have)

I've given examples already in this thread, but here's another two:

• A tower guild attempting to take more than one tower, only giving leads or assigned players the option of using guild chat to make it a more organized experience
• A GST guild, perhaps one that participates in both tournaments, wanting there to be less spam during the tournament when they might not always be available to communicate that (since actively sparring)

Also, blocking a player in a guild isn't a one-way functionality like it is in PMs - they can't see your messages if you block them, so it literally makes organizing the guild an even more difficult experience

Or I could just remove their permission to use guild chat?
You're not explaining how your alternative is better and that's generally what you have to do when you're arguing against something

If your stance is really "guild leaders should not be offered a full level of control over their guild" then I don't understand that at all
I'm not being rude with that comment if that's how it seems at all BTW, I just genuinely don't understand how someone could be against giving a guild leader full control over their own guild

I guess being able to recruit and kick people isn't enough power.

This suggestion is very bad because you can easily solve all these problems by doing one thing: kicking them.

If you don't want to hear what someone has to say, kick them or block them.

And I don't see how removing guild chat privileges from someone will make things more "organized," you will just be spammed with "PLEASE THALLEN LET ME TALK IN GUILD CHAT PLEASE"

not taking sides but guild members would most likely be mistreated with this option just because guild leaders would want to only speak to their "friends". So i'd rather stick to the kicking or blocking.

It's annoying to have to tell the people who are new to the guild what the expectations are. I agree with the concept of limited guild-broadcast messages, but maybe a middle ground is just to put it as a rule in your guild news (non-leads using guild chat get kicked) or something..? The issue there is that the people who would be jumping on guild chat to talk about their amazing bag lunch for school (or whatever 8 year olds talk about) probably wouldn't know how to navigate to the guild news anyway...

I agree but disagree with this option. For the most part this will limit very talkative players who distract others from doing their job but in some cases this will decrease the communication aspect of towering which is highly needed. It's not only new recruits that are "spam-a-holics" but a leaders friend's can do the same also.

I really dont see The problem with this idea.
Some guilds wants to focus on other things than chat and for those guilds this is Great.
Its an option for guilds to work The way The leader wants, if you need to guild chat, there are plenty of guilds for that.

The reason I don't like it is because:

1) All the problems/situations Thallen listed can easily be solved by blocking/kicking the person.

2) If someone is being annoying and you still want them to work for you but you don't want to hear them talk, that's basically like slavery. You can't just expect to recruit someone and make them work for you but not allow them to talk. If that happened to me I would immediately leave the guild.

3) A bunch of guild leaders who tower will probably only allow their friends to talk.

4) It will in result in members spamming the leader "PLEASE LET ME TALK IN GUILD CHAT PLEASE PLEASE"

Thallen gave an example earlier:

Ok first of all, you can block/kick him. But since apparently you don't like the thought of losing help for guild, you'd rather just take away his privilege to talk in the guild chat.

This is basically how I saw it:

Livid: spamming Thallen for the hat even though apparently he is an "active contributor" to the guild. (if he really was why would he be spamming for the hat?)

Thallen: Hey Livid. You're doing a really good job of helping me reach my goal and I really appreciate the help, but since you're doing something that I could easily solve by kicking or blocking you, I'm going to remove your guild chat option. But I still want you to help and defend and keep working for my guild, but you shouldn't be able to talk in the guild chat because I don't want you to. But I don't want to kick you either because I still want the free labor for my guild. So basically you're going to be my slave.

Also I see this option being a liability when it comes to towering, a big part of towering is communication. How is one supposed to warn people that a guild is beginning to attack if they can't use guild chat? How is one supposed to spam "FLAG" when they're the only one who isn't AFK in the flag room?

This makes you sound like somebody who duct tapes a child's mouth shut and doesn't let them speak unless you want them to.

What a simple way to put it, but yeah yoy dont need to shut a player up but taking their rights away, im sure the amendments still follow in-game.

You already have the power to kick/block and so does everyone else, if you don't want people spamming use what you have that's in front of you not suggest a ridiculous idea, and lets be realistic "PLS GIVE ME HAT" is not going to be spammed over guild chat but over private messages.

LOLing

Just because you see it as a good reason, doesn't mean others do. Nonetheless if staff likes the idea they'll add it in, if not they won't and don't even try convincing them. You already ruined the spar points system so don't try and ruin how socialize.

I don't see this ever being added.

what if im non american and the amendment's don't apply to me :[

i think it'll still apply because it's an American game. idk or france rule applys to the game.

How is it an American game? The company that owns the game is based in France.

Then France rule applies or the internet rules.

In canada the french have a whole province of their own to avoid that. And there are still a great many of us candians who have terrible french and take pride in it...