PC sparrers on iphone servers
 

what are your thoughts on having PC users sparring against idevice users?
unfair? fair? i wanna know.:\

Replace PC users with US members xD not every PC user on iServers are pros. Don´t global it keep it more exactly (if the point of the thread was that)

perfectly fair, it's all about preference of controls. keys are harder to use than on screen controls imo.

The screen entire screen is over the spar on iPod, so when pc players spar they don't get the advantage of a bigger view than the iPhone players. Basically it's just controls. Maybe the computer running faster than a iPod makes them fast,idk

It is unfair, it really is, but you can't blame the players for it. I understand how the iPhone community feels about it, you've all been sparring and doing competitive activities knowing that you're all using similar devices. Then comes the big bad evil PC players and change everything. That's all that I personally view it as though, a change. As callimuc said, not everyone is good on their PC's and really the people that are most complained about (such as Rashard) are top players on the PC version of Graal too. I don't think PC players have that great of an advantage either. I can move a lot more freely on my PC than I can on my iPod, but some iPod natives find iPod controls to be a lot easier. We see more of the screen, and we have the ability to type and do emotes faster, but this "they move 10% faster!" statistic just seems fishy. If PC players have too big of an advantage, there is nothing stopping you from getting on one.

I lose to iPhone players, and I can beat PC players on my iPod. It's a case of adjusting to something that has been forced onto the community. Players don't enjoy adjusting to new challenges in a way that dethrones them in competitive activities, but that is really not a PC players' fault, it's the bad integration it has had in the server itself. They've tried to make it fair by splitting the GST, but whether that's enough is up to the members of staff.

Wow I just have been reading the whole post. Anyway I can just agree with Rufus.

The benefits of the iPhone and the benefits of the PC way each of the negatives on each out. They both have their disadvantages and to be honest, it isn't effecting the spar scores as far as I can see.

It's kind of unfair. I say kind of because ideally it doesn't matter where you're sparring from, it just depends on how comfortable you are doing so. With that said, it is unfair that the iPhone players don't have the variety that we do.

That's so true. I personally find it harder to spar on iPhone, mainly because of my, now instinctual, PC spar habits. But that doesnt stop me from beating the iPhone kids ;)

With Rufus saying that a lot of PC users aren't on the skill level of US, I completely agree. I use PC to spar, and I'm not near that level of skill.

I wouldn't say it's unfair. It be unfair if they couldn't use a PC, but if people really think it's unfair, I typically just say use it yourself, and move on with it.

It isn't unfair since they're also aible to use PC. It's all a question about your skills,nothing more. If you practise hard,you'll may be US material ;)

Doesn't matter which platform you use, most PCs are much faster, but a good ios player can still beat PC players. Doesn't matter, just skill > all. However, the skill cap on PC is higher than it is on IOS.

just suck it up and deal with it

Lol Just_Me. I hate em, or I guess did...
Fair ;)

PC makes em' a little faster though

Tell it like it is.

personally they dont have any advantages :/ they just have less lag (in most cases). and like rufus said, not every pc sparrer has the same skill level as someone like rashard. i like having pc sparrers on iphone server; it presents a new challenge.

It's not fair... especially since their reason for not letting Graal PC players(not Facebook) play on iPhone servers were because "it wouldn't be fair to the iPhone players because PC gets a keyboard." Then Facebook Graal comes along and... it's perfectly fine! Yet PC players still can't play on iPhone servers...

It's perfectly fair I'm still on a 4g iPod. The only thing you can do is practice.deal with it. PCs do seem somewhat faster but speed isn't everything.You think it's unfair then don't spar at all you can always use a PC too.

How can I put this simply...

The addition of FaceBook client logging onto the iPhone server is fair in every way. It was possibly designed to attract people to either pay more gralats for VIP, or to grow from just simply an iPhone/ipod application to a game on one of the world's hottest sites, FaceBook. The migration of players from the original servers of Graal on PC has nothing to do with it.

However, I do see these members from both points of view, since I had the opportunity to meet some of them, and fight others. Let me be clear; PC is not faster. On a keyboard, you can use one finger for every direction key. On an iDevice, you generally use one finger for all directions. It becomes easier to change direction, but is it really all about movement? You can't win a spar by simply moving. Sparring on iPod for two years and PC for two months, I can clearly see different fighting styles in both devices, both with their own advantages and disadvantages. Sparring is all a matter of how well you can read the other persons movement pattern, and how you plan to react to it.

Once this is said, it is clear that sparrers who have been playing graal for so long on the original PC servers may have an advantage at using their fighting style they've perfected for years. Yes, it becomes harder for people who haven't played the game as long. In all honesty, do you really think the devices play a larger role in this than a huge difference in experience? The device is your personal opinion and/or preference. Spar style can go a long way, either client you happen to spar on.

i'm just going to say it's unfair due to experience.. There isn't really a disadvantage in controls.. but many people have been playing graal for 5-10-15 years. its just different skill. i mean i know what u mean.. pc does seem faster. for me they seem like they hit constant combos and are constantly going through my sword and stuff but idk its not unfair when it comes to speed

From sparring the two different clients, I realized a single main difference in technique. iPhone sparrers seem to use some type of hit-and-run technique, and attack in a single rhythm. PC sparrers are more used to either being rushed, or rushing in confidently towards the opponent. After one attack, one sets him/herself up for another. The majority of iPhone sparrers let in a breather. Both techniques can be effective, depending on which one you prefer, which one you practice, and how confidently you can execute the technique. Experiment!

Where is the like button???

Graal is no skill, no thinking, just doing. People don't plan their moves, they just do them. They run away then hit, that isn't much skill. I have no skill. Rashard has no skill. Kevin91 has no skill. Graal is all just countering and figuring out how to not get hit by running away, it's all a natural movement of your fingers, it gets to a point where you notice how you dont even think about how you move your fingers. One day I looked at my fingers as I was sparring and noticed how my fingers and my brain just move by themselves, almost like they were one. You move where you want without even thinking in less than a fraction of a second. I just don't think this game takes skill; just experience.

Does that mean boxers have no skill, for just running in and hitting the guy?

Boxing is completely nothing like sparring xD sparring is a video game, nothing really big to risk, people don't play so defencive like boxers do. boxers is physical skill as well as tactics. Graal is limited in it's tactics. I'm not sure if you know this but real life physical movement isn't as restricted as a 2d video game

Your logic was, 'running in and hitting people doesn't take skill'. And to the no defense thing, that isn't true. If there were no defensive maneuvers, everyone would get hit each time they sparred at the same time. There has to be skill, because if there wasn't, we wouldn't see people with 2k-100 ratios and 40k-5k ratios.

A boxing match is called a spar. :P

By no defence, i was talking about you can't block hits.. you can only dodge, boxing you can do numerous blocking and dodging, I really don't see how you could ever relate graal to boxing. i'm sorry.

I'm relating the style of the sport. In it, you dodge, block, and hit. In graal, you dodge and hit. The block concept might not be there, but the concept of maneuvering and predicting your opponents moves is.

yeahh i guess that's a good way to relate the two.

As far as blocking, I agree with you. However, boxing and Graal sparring are related (in my opinion) by technique. Both of them utilize hit-and-run/rushing, as well as staying on your guard and keeping track of the opponents movement patterns.

Eh if you think it takes skill, you may :P I think it takes no skill at all, cuz i dont strategize anything i ever do in spar, yet i have over 11,000 wins.

Strategy doesn't mean skill, but clearly, if you first started out in Graal you did bad. Now look at you? You're doing very well. This means you got better, hence you increased in skill.

Or you developed basic movements and basic moves. It doesn't take skill to fight irl, everyone knows how to punch, kick, dodge. not everyone knows how to use techniques and fighting styles.

A random ruffian who goes up to a trained martial arts expert is probably going to lose. If you developed moves and movements, then I'd say you gained skill.

so if someone learned how to punch someone in the stomach, they gained skill? and yeah I wasn't suggesting that you would win a fight if you went against a pro fighter. I didn't suggest that.

Nobody is right, nobody is wrong. Who are we to correct another person's opinion or views on a particular subject? This thread is for discussion, which I'm sure does not include criticizing each others views. Maybe it takes skill, maybe it doesn't. That isn't exactly the topic, anyway.

It's called a conversation, Shannon. I'm not arguing with him, I'm not mad at him. It is a debate, not an argument. This IS a discussion, and part of a debate is to criticize other's views on the topic. I see what he's saying and where he's coming from and I agree with some of the things he said. I'm not sure why you don't understand what a debate is, but I assure you, this isn't an argument Shannon.

Arguing is bad :c.

It is hard to determine if it is unfair, because it is unclear what the exact criteria is. PC controls are arguably more efficient than iphone/ipod touchscreen controls. That's where the idea of unfairness is drawn from.

I actually have to disagree with that.
I find that iPhone controls are far more efficient, due to the fact that I don't like using four fingers to move my character around on PC whilst pressing S repeatedly.

I agree with Kavan. The only reason that they do better than the iPhone players is that they've been sparring for many more years than we have. The only advantage I see is being able to see farther in guild spar, but iPads have the same ability.

I tried playing the ipod touch 4th gen and the controls were so awkward compared to PC. I feel that PC is more efficient. Maybe because that's how I started and have been using it for a 103 years, idk.

Thanks, I needed a good laugh ^_~;

i dont understand why graal cant run full speed on the iDevices....this game used to run silky smooth on a 233mhz computer ffs

I can still run the GraalEditor silky smooth on my old PoS computer... Recent Graal versions? Not so much...

True, nothing more can really be said. Stop complaining.