Posted by Cat612

I'm still going on about it? You brought it up again 4 hours later

http://i51.tinypic.com/6yjcpu.jpg (Unsupported image host)  

Very clever  

Ahh, here we have the "Cool Story Bro" picture. This picture is used when the poster, usually mad/at loss for words posts when he himself can not think of a clever reply to post back/knows he lost the fight. This picture is most likely used as a last ditch effort. Tune in to Animal Planet next week to learn the lifestyle of the Forever Alone picture.

Totally calling a "Cool Story Bro" picture posted in reply to this post  

Posted by Chaotic

If i was staff i'd still want too play the game as well, wouldnt you?

Yes, But i think the point of this post is to comprehend the idea that staff members, due to the nature of their job, are very, very popular in the graal community. This gives the idea that this extreme popularity in the community severley limits the ability for normal players to create guilds due to the fact that staff members have an obvious advantage over normal players when it comes to recruiting, due to the nature of their job.

Heres a better analogy: Imagine you were in gym class and your teacher allowed everyone to break into several groups of their own choosing for a basketball tournament. But the teacher, being an incredible college basketball player back in his heyday, allows himself to have his own team to compete in the tournament as well. Thus, most of the students who are experienced want to be on his team due to his part in college basketball history. Many people complain about this, but the teacher argues that since he was a college basketball player and loves the game, he wants too play it as well.

But that's just what I am getting from his argument.  

Posted by Pimpsy G.

Yes, But i think the point of this post is to comprehend the idea that staff members, due to the nature of their job, are very, very popular in the graal community. This gives the idea that this extreme popularity in the community severley limits the ability for normal players to create guilds due to the fact that staff members have an obvious advantage over normal players when it comes to recruiting, due to the nature of their job.

Heres a better analogy: Imagine you were in gym class and your teacher allowed everyone to break into several groups of their own choosing for a basketball tournament. But the teacher, being an incredible college basketball player back in his heyday, allows himself to have his own team to compete in the tournament as well. Thus, most of the students who are experienced want to be on his team due to his part in college basketball history. Many people complain about this, but the teacher argues that since he was a college basketball player and loves the game, he wants too play it as well.

But that's just what I am getting from his argument.

I agree with you about the recruiting advantage, but I would think they would know better not to take advantage of that and recruit people they already know and not some suck ups. If not, than that is an extreme advantage.  

Posted by TylerMysTe

I agree with you about the recruiting advantage, but I would think they would know better not to take advantage of that and recruit people they already know and not some suck ups. If not, than that is an extreme advantage.

That begs the question that who are the people that they already know? Are they just becoming friends with you because you are in this position? Even so, you can easily recruit the people you already know almost effortlessly due to the fact that they want to know you better because of your position. Thus, it is an advantage when taking this particular point of view of the OP into account.

Another thing that should be noted is that Pulse and VenusGospel aren't run by admins, and each of those guilds has had an era of dominance. I don't know of any other guilds that have been in first place in the last year and a half?

Of course there are going to be some (may i note, pre-zanza) player guilds that can make it. That doesn't mean there isn't still a severe hardship when it comes to normal players just starting off with a new guild.  

Posted by mr froggy

do u think admins should be alllowed to take forts or not?

i think they should be allowed to unless they completly change there name from there admin name

Nope, sorry, you're just jealous that other people are in admin guilds and you aren't. Sorry, but since most of the community revolves around these sacred guilds, this isn't going to change.

Another thing that should be noted is that Pulse and VenusGospel aren't run by admins, and each of those guilds has had an era of dominance. I don't know of any other guilds that have been in first place in the last year and a half?

Edit: Yeah, the bolded part was probably rude, and I can't judge you because I don't know you, so I apologize for that.

However this is simply the way Graal is. To remove all the admin guilds would essentially destroy the game and community, and hundreds of players would be extremely unhappy.

Edit 2: Just read through the thread. I have no sympathy for you. I take back the first edit.  

Posted by Pimpsy G.

That begs the question that who are the people that they already know? Are they just becoming friends with you because you are in this position? Even so, you can easily recruit the people you already know almost effortlessly due to the fact that they want to know you better because of your position. Thus, it is an advantage when taking this particular point of view of the OP into account.

You do have a point. I'm kind of debating between the two now. I haven't seen it as much of a problem where an admin guild towers over all the other guilds though so I think taking towers even as an admin is fine.  

I dunno, they way I took it, the guy doesn't want staff to have guilds because it takes away time from working. You may be right Pimpsy, but thats just the way I took it.  

Posted by Chaotic

I dunno, they way I took it, the guy doesn't want staff to have guilds because it takes away time from working. You may be right Pimpsy, but thats just the way I took it.

Im just stating what i think is being discussed here. But on my own opnion I have to admit that even if the staff were never allowed to have guilds, this effect will still happen. Declaring people as popular and, "celebrities" is in human nature.

Posted by SireCloud

I do agree that the popularity argument is a bit valid, but a group of friends that love to take towers and the likes have the same chance of succeeding as an admin guild. Look at the first few guilds that got 1k hrs. Yes, they heavily noobcruited, but for the most part they were all friends. I think staff should be allowed to play the game like everyone else, because not being able to play the game you are working for is pointless.

Yeah. Volunteer work pretty much is a result of this, either way the popularity factor cannot be avoided and should all around be ignored.  

I do agree that the popularity argument is a bit valid, but a group of friends that love to take towers and the likes have the same chance of succeeding as an admin guild. Look at the first few guilds that got 1k hrs. Yes, they heavily noobcruited, but for the most part they were all friends. I think staff should be allowed to play the game like everyone else, because not being able to play the game you are working for is pointless.  

Posted by SireCloud

I do agree that the popularity argument is a bit valid, but a group of friends that love to take towers and the likes have the same chance of succeeding as an admin guild. Look at the first few guilds that got 1k hrs. Yes, they heavily noobcruited, but for the most part they were all friends. I think staff should be allowed to play the game like everyone else, because not being able to play the game you are working for is pointless.

Exactly. Awhile ago, I used to be against staff having guilds and taking towers and stuff like that because of their popularity, but after awhile I realized they are still people who play the game so they deserve the same privelages as other players. A way to avoid the popularity recruiting conflict is for that staff to have another account and have them take over the guild, but go under a different name and make sure no one knows it's them.  

Posted by Chaotic

Ahh, here we have the "Cool Story Bro" picture. This picture is used when the poster, usually mad/at loss for words posts when he himself can not think of a clever reply to post back/knows he lost the fight. This picture is most likely used as a last ditch effort. Tune in to Animal Planet next week to learn the lifestyle of the Forever Alone picture.

Totally calling a "Cool Story Bro" picture posted in reply to this post

I was gettin around to it sooner or later  

sure a non-recruiting staff member should be allowed to have a guild,
but staff members having a competing guild? way unfair. unfortunately you wont get alot of support here since over half the players on graalians are in a staff guild, that they would no doubt leave/ stop putting tag on as much if the guilds staff quit being staff.

if you look at most games youll see that staff on those games are not allowed to have a compete,

simply put its these two major things that make it unfair, if you have a staff member in the guild they will be quicker and more likely to respond to hackers or "laggers" or people that are harrassing them, and a staff member affiliated and that cares about the guild will be more likely to be harsher when punishing players that are breaking rules when it comes to the tower.

secondly, youll see another unfair practice almost all guilds use, noob recruiting, apprenticing, temping, its all the same, just recruiting anyone around to make sure youve always got enough members, with staff guilds people are more likely to want to temp, especially if they "promise" that players the help alot will become actual members


why are people so desperate to get into a guild? its all about the fame of the guild, how they seem to be "The Best Guild Ever", how exclusive it is, and how being in one can basically guarantee that youll be hired.

if staff want to have a guild, then they will have no problem giving up the right to have anything to do with staff hiring, if they really want a tower taking guild then they will quit being staff and play as a player, think about it, look at how they are treated by players that think they are gods, if they really cared about being able to play the game like a player they wouldnt have accepted the job.

they can still play the game, still be in non-tower taking guilds if they give up the right to helping with hiring staff.

of course, its not like they will stop having guilds or actually listen to this, because nobody is making them, and staff honestly dont give a **** about what players think or consider if what they are doing is fair.  

Posted by Higbey

sure a non-recruiting staff member should be allowed to have a guild,
but staff members having a competing guild? way unfair. unfortunately you wont get alot of support here since over half the players on graalians are in a staff guild, that they would no doubt leave/ stop putting tag on as much if the guilds staff quit being staff.

if you look at most games youll see that staff on those games are not allowed to have a compete,

simply put its these two major things that make it unfair, if you have a staff member in the guild they will be quicker and more likely to respond to hackers or "laggers" or people that are harrassing them, and a staff member affiliated and that cares about the guild will be more likely to be harsher when punishing players that are breaking rules when it comes to the tower.

secondly, youll see another unfair practice almost all guilds use, noob recruiting, apprenticing, temping, its all the same, just recruiting anyone around to make sure youve always got enough members, with staff guilds people are more likely to want to temp, especially if they "promise" that players the help alot will become actual members


why are people so desperate to get into a guild? its all about the fame of the guild, how they seem to be "The Best Guild Ever", how exclusive it is, and how being in one can basically guarantee that youll be hired.

if staff want to have a guild, then they will have no problem giving up the right to have anything to do with staff hiring, if they really want a tower taking guild then they will quit being staff and play as a player, think about it, look at how they are treated by players that think they are gods, if they really cared about being able to play the game like a player they wouldnt have accepted the job.

they can still play the game, still be in non-tower taking guilds if they give up the right to helping with hiring staff.

of course, its not like they will stop having guilds or actually listen to this, because nobody is making them, and staff honestly dont give a **** about what players think or consider if what they are doing is fair.

the truth has been spoken...

I guess I made a mistake trying to prove the same point to a Zanza member, oh well