Posted by Imprint

There are the rules. Things slip through; it happens. Here's what the playerbase needs to get into their heads: Uploading customs is a privilige and whether you like it or not you have to follow the rules and the moderators (who sometimes make mistakes. NEWSFLASH: they're people too). If you believe that you were wrongfully banned, send in a ticket.

I sent in a ticket a year ago :,) here we are  

But I wasn't talking about uploads that slip through. There is admin created content (such as hats) in the game that are blatant references to television shows and other video games. How can you blame players for attempting to do the same thing?

It's awful that players could actually get permanently banned from uploading when they are seemingly following in the example of the admins. If they don't want confusion with the rules then they should follow them exactly as every ordinary player has to.  

Posted by Imprint

There are the rules. Things slip through; it happens. Here's what the playerbase needs to get into their heads: Uploading customs is a privilige and whether you like it or not you have to follow the rules and the moderators (who sometimes make mistakes. NEWSFLASH: they're people too). If you believe that you were wrongfully banned, send in a ticket.

Some one woke up on the wrong side of the bed.


Two possible solutions (instead of more hate) -

1.) Ditch the whole submission system. Scrap tf out of it. Make admins only allowed to upload shield/sword graphics from now on and make a quota of content they have to release in a month to keep up interest.


2.) Hire some friggin staff from the community of avid artists to go through the submissions and train them to hone their skills on what is 'acceptable' or not. Give reasons. Be very precise. Have a gold standard. Stop the monkey business of "oh its so hard" vs "you people are so dumb."


3.) (BONUS) Outline exactly what is allowed instead of relying on a single page written literally years ago regarding submissions guidelines. Show examples. Write a guide. Make it detailed. Give specific illustrations of what is not allowed AND WHY.

4.) (EVEN MORE BONUS) Stop with the pre-written single-button responses. This seems to be the biggest issue with the whole submission process - I know that it seems to streamline the function for administration by not having to write out explanations, but THREADS LIKE THIS show that the players are not able to upload in the fashion that is required in order to be acceptable and the explanations they are getting as to why their uploads are not acceptable just aren't detailed enough. Take out the stock responses - refer them to a page in the aforementioned guide (see point 3) to at least give a hint as to why their submissions are being denied. This will save time for players and the administration folks.  

Posted by 4-Lom

Two possible solutions (instead of more hate) -

1.) Ditch the whole submission system. Scrap tf out of it. Make admins only allowed to upload shield/sword graphics from now on and make a quota of content they have to release in a month to keep up interest.


2.) Hire some friggin staff from the community of avid artists to go through the submissions and train them to hone their skills on what is 'acceptable' or not. Give reasons. Be very precise. Have a gold standard. Stop the monkey business of "oh its so hard" vs "you people are so dumb."


3.) (BONUS) Outline exactly what is allowed instead of relying on a single page written literally years ago regarding submissions guidelines. Show examples. Write a guide. Make it detailed. Give specific illustrations of what is not allowed AND WHY.

4.) (EVEN MORE BONUS) Stop with the pre-written single-button responses. This seems to be the biggest issue with the whole submission process - I know that it seems to streamline the function for administration by not having to write out explanations, but THREADS LIKE THIS show that the players are not able to upload in the fashion that is required in order to be acceptable and the explanations they are getting as to why their uploads are not acceptable just aren't detailed enough. Take out the stock responses - refer them to a page in the aforementioned guide (see point 3) to at least give a hint as to why their submissions are being denied. This will save time for players and the administration folks.

Both GPs and GATs review uploads already, hiring avid artists to do them is pretty redundant especially when all that will happen is that they will go through the same process as us and increase the chances of someone approving an upload for a friend or themselves that should not be approved. Being able to specify the problem with the upload submitted is a great idea, however, this is going to take up a lot of time especially if it happens to be only one person online doing all of them. There are already many players complaining about their upload is taking too long to be reviewed despite only waiting an hour, not sure they would appreciate the process taking even longer. It's pretty easy to spot if an upload breaks any rules other than the occasional one that can be rather odd. There will be certain occasions where we all differ in opinion and we find certain things acceptable/unacceptable. This is something that can easily be cleared up.

I've heard about quite a few people who appealed their upload ban and it was removed although it may be the minority. Getting unbanned is probably one of the things that aren't very definite at the moment from what i've seen  

After thinking about it, I can say a few things regarding the general conversation here.

1. The "Inspired" Vs. "Ripped off" argument will not be solved with any change of the guide lines. It is a judgement call. Also, calling out the staff for their use of copyrighted works won't solve anything, either.

2. You can't just "hire better staff" or "train them better' it doesn't work like that. From what I've noticed the most active players don't want to be staff anyways. Do you really believe it's feasible to make someone who applied for a volunteer position go through 10-20 hours of training? Who would train them anyways? It takes up time that, as shown by the upload wait times, staff don't have.

3. Asking staff to write detailed descriptions is not a viable solution. I assume that there are probably 30 uploads an hour(maybe more, maybe less, I have never been staff so I don't know). If you add 2 more minutes to every upload the adminisator has to review, he/she will not be able to keep up, or get any other work done. The process of reviewing an upload must be streamlined. It cannot work in any other fashion.

4. They won't ever ditch the uploads system. First of all the players of today would never accept it, and it also who take away the games money maker(not that they are selfish, but I am sure it's a decision that those who finance the game wouldn't approve of).

5. The only solution I have seen is creating a guide online that players may reference as to why their graphic is being denied. With articles such as "Your Background is Visible", "Your Graphic is too small", etc. The articles should be simple, but offer insight Into why this is happening to you and how you can fix it. Then adminisators could reference articles in their rejections, and hope the player will read them and be able to fix the issue. However, there are issues with this as well.

A. Uploads can be broken in unique ways, and I would for see much complaining of "the guides fix didn't work for me!" And stuff along those lines.

B. To have this be professional it would need to be packaged into a uploading website, which would take time. At least I feel that would be required.

C. With the hat quotas and the pressure on the GAT staff, I don't know if they would have the time to make a comprehensive upload guide. However, that should not be used as an excuse, either.

This is the only solution I can see right now.  

I sent in a ticket, got a reply, I replied, they unbanned me from uploading. Took 1-2 weeks.  

Posted by 4-Lom

4.) (EVEN MORE BONUS) Stop with the pre-written single-button responses. This seems to be the biggest issue with the whole submission process - I know that it seems to streamline the function for administration by not having to write out explanations, but THREADS LIKE THIS show that the players are not able to upload in the fashion that is required in order to be acceptable and the explanations they are getting as to why their uploads are not acceptable just aren't detailed enough. Take out the stock responses - refer them to a page in the aforementioned guide (see point 3) to at least give a hint as to why their submissions are being denied. This will save time for players and the administration folks.

No, it won't. We've already had this discussion. Players will be waiting days to get their upload. Most players don't care about the explanation, as evidenced by the upload bans. (Wow, do not resubmit? Better spam it.)

Do you want an explanation of why your upload is being denied? Sure, I'll give you one. Out of tens of thousands (I wish this was an exaggeration) of personal uploads I've gone through, maybe ten people ask me why their upload was denied.

I said this a ton in the other thread, and I'll say it again: you can message me about an upload and I'll try and work through it with you or at least explain what's wrong.

What rules aren't on http://classicupload.graalonline.com/ are well known in the community, the main one being about doll bodies (which is actually half covered by what is on there, it says "no small or invisible graphics").

As it stands, the system is NOT the problem. Do you really mean to tell me that the guy sending sprites ripped directly from Undertale as shields was somehow left blind-sighted because "Copyright Infringement: Do not resubmit" was too vague, especially after he received it more than 10 times?  

Posted by Jarace

No, it won't. We've already had this discussion. Players will be waiting days to get their upload. Most players don't care about the explanation, as evidenced by the upload bans. (Wow, do not resubmit? Better spam it.)

Do you want an explanation of why your upload is being denied? Sure, I'll give you one. Out of tens of thousands (I wish this was an exaggeration) of personal uploads I've gone through, maybe ten people ask me why their upload was denied.

I said this a ton in the other thread, and I'll say it again: you can message me about an upload and I'll try and work through it with you or at least explain what's wrong.

What rules aren't on http://classicupload.graalonline.com/ are well known in the community, the main one being about doll bodies (which is actually half covered by what is on there, it says "no small or invisible graphics").

As it stands, the system is NOT the problem. Do you really mean to tell me that the guy sending sprites ripped directly from Undertale as shields was somehow left blind-sighted because "Copyright Infringement: Do not resubmit" was too vague, especially after he received it more than 10 times?

Tbh, when I was admin for 2 months I always sent selfmade pm's of what was wrong with peoples uploads if I denied them lol
It's not that big of a deal to do  

Posted by iBubble

Tbh, when I was admin for 2 months I always sent selfmade pm's of what was wrong with peoples uploads if I denied them lol
It's not that big of a deal to do

The world needs more people like you <3  

I got a warning back then like 2015? then I ask the admin Xor* is it really true? cause the warning I got was a PMessage. Then he told me yes but it is just a warning.  

Posted by Jarace

No, it won't. We've already had this discussion. Players will be waiting days to get their upload. Most players don't care about the explanation, as evidenced by the upload bans. (Wow, do not resubmit? Better spam it.)

If there's no explanation as to what was 'wrong' with the submission, I for one would personally make my best guess, do a quick edit, and re-send it to see if it was a small or more obvious error. Not spam. Lack of information provided.

Do you want an explanation of why your upload is being denied? Sure, I'll give you one. Out of tens of thousands (I wish this was an exaggeration) of personal uploads I've gone through, maybe ten people ask me why their upload was denied.

If there were some kind of indication of which admin was online and/or who was currently receiving/reviewing submissions, I can't speak for others but I would probably attempt to discuss a concept prior to even starting the design. The answers I do get from known admins are usually vague and sometimes not entirely accurate... compared to what others say.

I said this a ton in the other thread, and I'll say it again: you can message me about an upload and I'll try and work through it with you or at least explain what's wrong.

Shout this from the mountains. When you're online.

What rules aren't on http://classicupload.graalonline.com/ are well known in the community, the main one being about doll bodies (which is actually half covered by what is on there, it says "no small or invisible graphics").

I literally had five different responses for the exact same upload when it was suggested that I upload 'a few hours later when some one else was reviewing submissions.' Even the admins don't all know the rules or agree on them.

As it stands, the system is NOT the problem. Do you really mean to tell me that the guy sending sprites ripped directly from Undertale as shields was somehow left blind-sighted because "Copyright Infringement: Do not resubmit" was too vague, especially after he received it more than 10 times?

We're your customers. We're saying it's a problem.  

I don't think there are a ton of available graphics that are ripped from copyrighted sources for people to upload. If graphic artists are making their inspired works too obvious, then we need to start there and make it clear that none of their work will be of use to the game.

Also, I agree that the system should be reworked but since it doesn't sound like that isn't going to happen, then maybe make a small adjustment and get rid of permanent bans or put a PERSON in charge of graphics ban appeals.  

Let Coco or Leah or GFX admins solely review the uploads. GP's lack the artistic skill.  

Posted by iBubble

Tbh, when I was admin for 2 months I always sent selfmade pm's of what was wrong with peoples uploads if I denied them lol
It's not that big of a deal to do

I'm on every day at a time that runs me into an average of 150 personal uploads just on login. While this would be ideal, it's not practical and I have other things I need to be doing. Most of them are well covered by the basics, fortunately.

Posted by 4-Lom

removed for your reading pleasure (saving page space)

1) No, that's not spam. Glad we agree on that. Most people just send the same thing without any changes even if it's something simple, even then, they aren't all going to be upload banned unless it is REALLY disruptive or they are copyrighted.

2) In general, the denials are pretty consistent. If something slips through and it shouldn't have been approved, it will be refunded and, similar to above, you won't be upload banned unless you've done it a lot with copyrighted stuff or you are a very, very frequent offender.

3) 3-4 PM EST is usually when I get on if anyone is curious. If you want to talk to me about an upload, message me on here or in-game and we can try to work out a time.

4) Does it happen? Yeah, but I wouldn't say it's all that often. You seem to have had a particularly bad experience, which might be because of the style of your graphics, and I'm sorry it has turned out this way.

5) I'd like to see a server-wide survey, going by my experience I don't think many people have an issue with it. But hey, who knows.

Posted by winry

I don't think there are a ton of available graphics that are ripped from copyrighted sources for people to upload. If graphic artists are making their inspired works too obvious, then we need to start there and make it clear that none of their work will be of use to the game.

Also, I agree that the system should be reworked but since it doesn't sound like that isn't going to happen, then maybe make a small adjustment and get rid of permanent bans or put a PERSON in charge of graphics ban appeals.

People rip them or remake them pixel for pixel. It's very clear that copyrighted content is not allowed. If the rules aren't enough on the website, being denied several times or refunded several times should really get the message across.

Real people check the appeals.

Posted by Bryan*

Let Coco or Leah or GFX admins solely review the uploads. GP's lack the artistic skill.

As much as I'd love to push the work to them, I think GPs are more than qualified for uploading. All they're doing is checking the upload against the rules.  

Posted by Jarace

I'd like to see a server-wide survey, going by my experience I don't think many people have an issue with it. But hey, who knows.

My experience is that non-staff who make their own graphics have issue with the system. The majority of players in a 'server-wide' survey would not know what they're talking about, as they haven't made graphics. Even if you have hundreds of uploads a day, it does not indicate that anywhere near a majority is busily making shields.

Staff who have graphics experience seem to upload whatever they want without consequence. I would like the same freedom to an extent - case in point...



There's no active waterfall furniture for us to use in the game. I made my own shield (drew on in-game colors to match with water and matched the graphic style in a home-made animation) and it was denied. What to do?