So with everything being nerfed (and possibly causing inflation), is it possible to buff pyrat bay reward to 1.5K or 2K?  

Posted by Marill

when admins say temporary they mean about a year

Temporary til 1 second before the servers shut down for the last time some day  

Posted by Bryan*

So with everything being nerfed (and possibly causing inflation), is it possible to buff pyrat bay reward to 1.5K or 2K?

You don't get the concept of nerfing, do you?  

Nerfing is when something in a game is too easy so to you make changes to balance the game. Issue is, there are mounts that cost 100,000 gralats. thats around 90ish hours of looting, about 4 days straight nonstop looting for one overpriced item. Obviously there are items cheaper than 100k but you discourage so many people from doing these boring activities. Looting isn't even that fun, it would be fun if there was a big reward but there isn't at all.
With this said, we understand there is a power above the development staff that want people buying gralat packs. "Balancing the game" basically means forcing people into buying gralat packs to buy a big amount of the items they desire
and we do appreciate the work you guys do for the game, obviously graal would be dead without you guys. just wish the game wasn't owned by a greedy assh0le  

To be fair, Graal Classic has become a "pay-to-look-good" and we cant complain that much, the game has no objective or goal  

Posted by Dusty

You don't get the concept of nerfing, do you?

A change in the game that causes it to be less desirable and/or less effective. The change in looting prices impacted a portion of the economy in iClassic, causing the players to have resentment. It is possible to nerf the currency (other games have done it), not just items and/or weaponry. So if this is wrong, mind explaining it (if you cannot on this thread, a PM is fine as well. I don't mean to sound aggressive or attacking your decision).
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These are our in-game methods to obtain gralats:
• Pyrat Bay (1K)
• Looting (prices changed)
• Bug Catching (prices changed)
• House / GH Farming
• Overworld Farming (gralat stealing / not recommended)
• Crab Chance (waste 50 to obtain more)  

Posted by Dusty

You don't get the concept of nerfing, do you?

If you're gonna make it longer to get gralats, then you need to reduce the prices of the damn items.  

So much complaining in 1 thread....it's making my head hurt...  

Posted by Bryan*

A change in the game that causes it to be less desirable and/or less effective. The change in looting prices impacted a portion of the economy in iClassic, causing the players to have resentment. It is possible to nerf the currency (other games have done it), not just items and/or weaponry. So if this is wrong, mind explaining it (if you cannot on this thread, a PM is fine as well. I don't mean to sound aggressive or attacking your decision).
-------------------------------------------------------
These are our in-game methods to obtain gralats:
• Pyrat Bay (1K)
• Looting (prices changed)
• Bug Catching (prices changed)
• House / GH Farming
• Overworld Farming (gralat stealing / not recommended)
• Crab Chance (waste 50 to obtain more)

Posted by SomeGuy

If you're gonna make it longer to get gralats, then you need to reduce the prices of the damn items.

I'm not arguing about whether or not it's valid, I'm just saying that if things are being nerfed it's for a reason. We're not going to double up what you get at another quest when we halve something else... that doesn't make sense. We also don't need to lower prices of items at all... again, the logic doesn't make sense. Why would we halve income from a job and then halve the prices of items? Where would that get anyone?

Not like any of this matters. My goal is not to make items worth more or worth less. There was a much large spike of income coming from Diving than in the past years so it was tweaked as part of a process of adjusting and seeing what needs to happen. You can believe me or not, at this point it doesn't matter. Players were gaining millions of gralats from broken bug spawns and they still cried foul when it was fixed. They figured out how easily bees could be manipulated and caught, and whined when they couldn't be anymore(despite the fact I have been tweaking bees since the new system to be more easily caught).

Players whine whenever an easy way to make money is nerfed, despite very logical reasons. When diving was released it was constantly tweaked until players were making what I considered a satisfactory amount. I constantly buffed diving, and even doubled the sell price of items in the first month. Now diving is suddenly too good and it needed to be tweaked in the other direction. I've explained the multiple reasons why diving might be pulling in more than it did a few years ago, but no one wants to listen. I've also said the change is probably temporary but it's easy to brandish your pitchforks and torches.

All said and done people seem to always forget what Graal is. It's a game that needs to make a profit, and the only way it makes a profit is mostly from gralat packs. I'm imagining most of the people here who complain about money being harder to make have never bought a single gralat pack or hardly supported the game past maybe the customization pack. I know of one person who hasn't in this thread.

Again, that doesn't concern me anyways. My goal is to keep jobs balanced within their intended designs. For example, trying to add more season bugs to fall and winter to balance bug catching with looting during the off-seasons... because bug catching isn't balanced currently the way it's designed! It does go both ways, but no one says anything when it works in their favor... especially not when they're too busy exploiting obvious bugs and then whine when it's fixed.  

Posted by Dusty

Players whine whenever an easy way to make money is nerfed, despite very logical reasons.

I never would've made this thread or said anything if there were logical reasons. I honestly have no idea why anyone brought up the issues with bugs, that was an entirely different situation. They were glitched and there was a legitimate problem with them that needed to be addressed. Anyone that complained about them is either an entitled idiot OR they had saved up tons of bugs that they had caught months before the glitch and feel cheated out of gralats they should've legitimately earned.

As for your reasons, and correct me if I am wrong, but I believe you just said that people have made more from looting this year compared to last year (and previous years) likely due to the introduction of Big City and Destiny and their massive areas of water. First, and you dodged this question earlier, what exactly do you mean they have acquired more income from looting compared to last year? You've compared players' individual earnings over the years? Couldn't they have just looted more this year compared to prior years? Possibly due to the nerfs in other methods? And if you mean the total amount earned by the population of Graal from looting has gone up, couldn't that just correspond to a larger player base? Numbers mean nothing without context. Secondly, Big City existed all of last year, so the same opportunity for looting was available then as it is now. The Oasis has been around even longer, but I guess I won't count that since not everyone has access to it.

To me, and possibly many others, I have not experienced any change in the amount of gralats I've earned from looting, and I've used looting as my main source of income since I started my account in 2013. That is why I feel it's a legitimate issue to complain about. I prefer evidence and facts about how it's been concluded that looting is unbalanced, not just presumptions and premature nerfs.  

Tbh if unix is worried about their bread supply why not just have players watch a 30 sec ad every time they log on.  

First things first, I've spent over $1000 on graal classic alone, and i know for certain Ivy has spent around the same or more. Also if Unix is so concerned about making a profit for graal (while he does nothing) then the least he can do is update the server. I understand exactly where you are coming from dusty, but some of your points arent valid when Unix cant even upgrade so we can properly play.  

Posted by Dusty

... gralats from broken bug spawns and they still cried foul when it was fixed. They figured out how easily bees could be manipulated and caught, and whined when they couldn't be anymore(despite the fact I have been tweaking bees since the new system to be more easily caught).

I, for one, don't care what an individual bee is worth, but would not mind having more than a slight chance of getting one. I've tried, and maybe there's lag issues (I run around 340-400 at most times), but it has yet to happen.

Now diving is suddenly too good and it needed to be tweaked in the other direction. I've explained the multiple reasons why diving might be pulling in more than it did a few years ago, but no one wants to listen.

Looting may have increased due to bug nerfing. People may just spend more time doing it because it's the more worth while activity, I sure did, but the fact of the matter is threads like this with dialogue prove that people want to understand and, better yet, be informed when changes are coming. After having more than 4000 gralats just disappear (what I thought was about 8 hours of effort on my part) I'm pretty disappointed that I hadn't sold the day before. Sure, 4k isn't much in the big picture, but it feels, as a player, like theft.

I'm imagining most of the people here who complain about money being harder to make have never bought a single gralat pack or hardly supported the game past maybe the customization pack. I know of one person who hasn't in this thread.

If this is sincerely an issue, make the game cost money to download instead of using it as a scapegoat to make things more difficult for long time players. I don't, won't and haven't bought a pack. Proud to say so, in fact. Instead of pretending like it's a favor to us and blasting the gameplay mechanics, release an iclassic 2.0, charge 99 cents, and hire some friggin labor to make the game some awesome content worth paying for. Monetization shouldn't feel like ill treatment to players, if done right, it should be encouraged and enthusiastic.

...because bug catching isn't balanced currently the way it's designed! It does go both ways, but no one says anything when it works in their favor... especially not when they're too busy exploiting obvious bugs and then whine when it's fixed.

Well, buggy material can be pre-tested and fixed. Again, warning or informing everyone of what's happening with a mention on the game loading page (or an in game news announcement informing the community to prepare for changes to a system) would go a long way to curb the rage. As to bugs being fixed, there are still issues. Namely the spawn rate, lag, and varieties available seem to be a mystery. If it's exploitable, we will find it. Bugs getting a reduction in effective earning over time just made us go to loot instead. It will happen the other way, if loot is found to still be more 'balanced'.

Posted by Noxious

Numbers mean nothing without context. Secondly, Big City existed all of last year, so the same opportunity for looting was available then as it is now. The Oasis has been around even longer, but I guess I won't count that since not everyone has access to it.

Again, it makes sense that statistically the looting may increase due to an increase in that behavior as it was realized to be worth more for your time after the bug decreases happened. Bugs, having maybe returned to price in some cases, but become more difficult and time consuming to catch across the board, got mostly abandoned as an activity. Not to mention they don't go in houses anymore, which may be a deterrent to thousands of newer players who have less incentive to catch them.

That is why I feel it's a legitimate issue to complain about. I prefer evidence and facts about how it's been concluded that looting is unbalanced, not just presumptions and premature nerfs.

Complaining doesn't get it fixed, but bringing it to light may avoid or help mitigate future issues. It has been expressed that the amounts need to be adjusted in order to 'balance'...

If it were in my power, I wouldn't want players to feel cheated - instead of cutting the prices on items they already had worked for, I would simply stem the flow a bit by reducing spawn rate of insects or loot. If the prices really need to be adjusted, I'd surely warn people ahead of time so they didn't feel robbed and to be transparent.

Think about if your employer suddenly cut your wages in half without warning you on your next paycheque and basically said 'it had to be done - you were making too much money.'  

How about we reset the loot prices for now? I think this temporary change is being tested at a bad time. A lot of players had been saving up for bigger events like Halloween and Christmas. It comes as a shock to them that now they will not have enough money to purchase items. Possibly, make the prices for the items for Halloween and Christmas even higher to even out the income players have. I get that this an issue that needs to be fixed but just not the right time for it. Will most likely get complains either way but at least players wont be hurt as much.  

Interesting that this is right before Halloween, not surprised really if they killed bug catching why not kill off the best way to make gralats as of right now and encourage people to buy packs. (Yes I understand the bugs were broken)