Posted by TD*

If the other player disconnects at 0.5 in a spar match, should you get the win?

But

Posted by Kosiris

"I should get the win for beating person A, even when I don't slash my sword at him at 0.5HP and actually kill him!", flawed logic right there.

omg...

 

Posted by deadowl

And that's why I said it's a better system, assuming it's tied to AP, to respawn a player at the same health in the case of a death where no one gets a kill. Suicides and TKing for the sake of annoying other players is antisocial.

not everyone does it just to annoy people. Some people do it so they can quickly get back to full strength. What if mod is taken and I'm left at 0.5, do I have to go in and beg someone to kill me? Some of us take pride in not dying easily or often, so that seems lame to me. Besides that There would be a big devaluation of the death stat.

so much on this game creates the same "antisocial" environment. Stealing Gralats is antisocial, yet people aren't searching for a fix(yet).

Posted by deadowl

Also keep in mind that having someone sit off-tag to collect kills is against Graal's TOS and will result in a ban.

How will they monitor for that?

Posted by deadowl

I repeat, suicides and TKing for the sake of annoying other players is antisocial. It literally makes the game less fun.

What about those who don't do it to annoy other players? What if I'm a farmer who doesn't want to lose my bombs?

Posted by deadowl

Maybe you should just consider the fact that you suck at towering Sardon's if you found yourself stuck in a death loop there.

Would you like me to throw back in your face "maybe If you can't kill a suicider then you just should consider the fact that you suck at pking"? Probably not.

But for a real argument, this update is mostly for the newbies who can't get suiciders easily. Do you realize that they do suck at Sards, so that indeed will be a problem for them? Noobs could and would get in death spirals at Sards because of this.

All I see this doing is making Pking more annoying at certain places.  

Posted by Areo

not everyone does it just to annoy people. Some people do it so they can quickly get back to full strength. What if mod is taken and I'm left at 0.5, do I have to go in and beg someone to kill me? Some of us take pride in not dying easily or often, so that seems lame to me. Besides that There would be a big devaluation of the death stat.

so much on this game creates the same "antisocial" environment. Stealing Gralats is antisocial, yet people aren't searching for a fix(yet).

All antisocial aspects of the game should be addressed at some point. There's matters of priority, but I'm responding to this thread and not a thread about a different issue in gameplay.

How will they monitor for that?

Computers are exceptional counting machines. Record sets of events that meet an weighted set of criteria (e.g. off-tag guild member kills on-tag guild member), provide a threshold (e.g. 5 times per minute), and report any activity exceeding that threshold for review. I will yield that these systems require statistical analysis in order to minimize false-negatives and false-positives.

What about those who don't do it to annoy other players? What if I'm a farmer who doesn't want to lose my bombs?

That's why I suggested a tie-in to AP. Farmers don't generally have low AP.

Would you like me to throw back in your face "maybe If you can't kill a suicider then you just should consider the fact that you suck at pking"? Probably not.

Maybe if you can't kill a suicider, the suicider is being antisocial, and the community deserves better.

But for a real argument, this update is mostly for the newbies who can't get suiciders easily. Do you realize that they do suck at Sards, so that indeed will be a problem for them? Noobs could and would get in death spirals at Sards because of this.

Everyone starts somewhere, and newbies are more likely to be turned off by antisocial behavior than level of difficulty.

All I see this doing is making Pking more annoying at certain places.

And I see this making PKing less annoying at certain places. If it wasn't annoying, nobody would have posted a thread about it.  

You can still run all your strats.
Just that the pker gets the kill, not you, your guildmates, or spikes.

What is so hard to understand, that you can suicide, but the kill goes to the pker who registered the last hit.

Bombs are worth 15g... if you are a farmer, you should have enough money to buy more.

Why make excuses, when there is no need? Pker should get the kill. People mostly suicide, at least against me, just so I won't pk them 24/7.  

Posted by TD*

If the other player disconnects at 0.5 in a spar match, should you get the win?

If a player disconnects during a spar at 3 HP you should get the win. If it doesn't work that way, the server is stupid.  

Posted by Skyzer

If a player disconnects during a spar at 3 HP you should get the win. If it doesn't work that way, the server is stupid.

Disconnecting is a forfeit in spar. So far this thread has spawned three arguments in regard to suicide/accidental-self-kill which includes the forfeit argument. Should suicide/accidental-self-kill be considered a forfeit in PKing (someone gets a kill)? A dumb-move/anti-strategy (respawn at previous health given AP threshold)? Or should it remain as a legitimate strategy (albeit particularly antisocial in most contexts)?  

Posted by Areo

How will they monitor for that?

If Player 1 kills Player 2 too many times without Player 2 killing Player 1, a message can been sent to the server that can be seen by staff members using the Graal Remote Control.  

Posted by deadowl

All antisocial aspects of the game should be addressed at some point. There's matters of priority, but I'm responding to this thread and not a thread about a different issue in gameplay.

Think that would probably be easier to address, but yeah, let's keep it relevant.

Posted by deadowl

Computers are exceptional counting machines. Record sets of events that meet an weighted set of criteria (e.g. off-tag guild member kills on-tag guild member), provide a threshold (e.g. 5 times per minute), and report any activity exceeding that threshold for review. I will yield that these systems require statistical analysis in order to minimize false-negatives and false-positives.

They could have them wear a different guild tag. Or if you meant any member not on that tag, what if it's a noob guild and it's a very good pker, who can kill them all very fast? I've seen people get over 10-20 kills a minute. The point im making is that it would be very difficult to actually tell who is kill collecting and who is not.

Posted by deadowl

That's why I suggested a tie-in to AP. Farmers don't generally have low AP.

That's true, but with the blob being in swamp, a lot of them now have lowish(10-40)AP.

Posted by deadowl

Maybe if you can't kill a suicider, the suicider is being antisocial, and the community deserves better.

I haven't really said this before, but I really don't know why it being antisocial matters all that much. Pking isn't a predominantly social activity, in its purest form.

Posted by deadowl

Everyone starts somewhere, and newbies are more likely to be turned off by antisocial behavior than level of difficulty.

If you're sure, that's all a matter of perspective.

Posted by deadowl

And I see this making PKing less annoying at certain places. If it wasn't annoying, nobody would have posted a thread about it.

Where will it make pking less annoying?

Spoiler

im not saying a good alternative can't be found, and im sure you could probably find one. I'm more saying that this one wouldn't be it, in my opinion

Posted by Skyzer

If Player 1 kills Player 2 too many times without Player 2 killing Player 1, a message can been sent to the server that can be seen by staff members using the Graal Remote Control.

But player 2 will still kill player 1, when his HP is low enough and he doesn't want to be killed by the pker/attacker.

My other concern is still the how quickly you would rack up deaths at destiny and sards, since getting killed by the spikes is still relatively easy.  

I feel like someone managing to kill himself at 0.5 is a skill part of pking i wouldnt remove or try to fix it personally.  

it's not even a big deal...  

Id only say remove teammates getting the kill on you with arrows or bombs so it's only used as a tower technique to make sure your members are always on full hp. You shouldn't be given the kill for something you didn't even do.

When I pk (barely) it's usually towards a goal, if someone suicides then it just backfires onto them since I'll just be pking longer until I get my goal. Pkers should have that mindset coming into a tower to pk, or just plain and simple - get good?  

I think bombs and arrows should hit teammates... Otherwise they could just arrow a side of the flag where attackers and defenders are hitting it, and it will knock all the attackers off, while leaving their teammates there to continue hitting it. I don't see the problem with suiciding... I mean people get hundreds of PKs each day, is 1 person suiciding really a big deal? If you can't get them when it counts, you shouldn't get the kill.  

Arrows that are able to affect your enemies, including other players, baddies but not your own team mates? What are they made of pure steel?  

I never said they won't hit your teammates....I just said you wouldn't get the kill for it  

Posted by alexx

I never said they won't hit your teammates....I just said you wouldn't get the kill for it

But they do get the kill.. Seems pointless to not give them the kill. That's not solving any problem, it's just making people less mad when others do it. It's really a pointless thing to do.