Posted by Hoyt

The upload token system is a band aid fix for a serious bug that some players were abusing to generate tons of gralats for nothing. The bug isn't something that scripters can fix, so the only real option is to work around it. No one wanted to add upload tokens but they are the best solution currently available.

damn hey hoyt since when did you start working on classic wtf

also what was the issue that was being abused to exploit gralats, did it have to do with waiting until uploads were cheap and then refunding them for an increased price  

Posted by Faz

1.How much tokens does it take to buy a head/upload?

2. How many tokens do you get from refunding?

Upload tokens are 1:1 with gralats. 1 token = 1 gralat.
It works the same way as before, except now you get tokens instead of gralats.  

Posted by Hoyt

The upload token system is a band aid fix for a serious bug that some players were abusing to generate tons of gralats for nothing. The bug isn't something that scripters can fix, so the only real option is to work around it. No one wanted to add upload tokens but they are the best solution currently available.

that just tells me that people are being lazy to do their own job. if you're a GP then it's your duty to ban these sorts of people rather than implementing a new system and "working your way around it" if people have kept up with this for the longest time, then would it hurt to keep doing that  

Okay  

Posted by Hoyt

The upload token system is a band aid fix for a serious bug that some players were abusing to generate tons of gralats for nothing.

But isn’t the system the exact same just it now gives tokens instead of Gralats, since there is no supposedly way to script a fix?

So they will just abuse it for tons of upload tokens and get more uploads than they actually paid for.  

So basically when you refund an upload you can only use the refunded gralats for uploads only.

 

Posted by Colin

But isn’t the system the exact same just it now gives tokens instead of Gralats, since there is no supposedly way to script a fix?

So they will just abuse it for tons of upload tokens and get more uploads than they actually paid for.

BaSiCaLlY  

Posted by Thallen

damn hey hoyt since when did you start working on classic wtf

also what was the issue that was being abused to exploit gralats, did it have to do with waiting until uploads were cheap and then refunding them for an increased price

I started working on Era and Ol' West a few months ago, I've only worked on a couple small things for Classic though, I'm spread thin enough as it is! I don't want to say much about the exploit until it is totally fixed, but it wasn't anything related to the sales.

Posted by Colin

But isn’t the system the exact same just it now gives tokens instead of Gralats, since there is no supposedly way to script a fix?

So they will just abuse it for tons of upload tokens and get more uploads than they actually paid for.

More people started discovering the exploit, and it was becoming a serious issue on all of the iOS servers. It's a lot easier to deal with people getting free uploads than it is to deal with people getting tons of gralats and doing everything they can to launder them. We're hoping the upload token system won't be around forever, but it'll be there until the underlying bug is fixed or someone comes up with a nicer solution.

Posted by starry

that just tells me that people are being lazy to do their own job. if you're a GP then it's your duty to ban these sorts of people rather than implementing a new system and "working your way around it" if people have kept up with this for the longest time, then would it hurt to keep doing that

The GPs do a fine job, but this isn't the sort of thing they are around for. GPs deal with player issues and exploits that happen on the player's computer: speed hacking, wall hacking, changing ganis, things like that. Being able to gain hundreds of thousands of gralats a day for free is a much more serious issue and needs to be fixed on the server.  

just make uploading free , easy fix  

So, 2 questions I got about this.

1. How do we know how many "tokens" we have? I don't see anything that shows any any token amount.
2. How do we get Tokens to buy Uploads?  

Posted by Rusix

So, 2 questions I got about this.

1. How do we know how many "tokens" we have? I don't see anything that shows any any token amount.
2. How do we get Tokens to buy Uploads?

pretty sure you still have to pay actual gralats. for example, you get tokens by selling uploads. so if u sell an old head you'll get 10,000 tokens. then let's say you want to upload a head, it'll take 10,000g and 10,000 tokens. and also you can see the tokens in your inventory.  

It was a workaround for a bug? Hooray for bug smashing!
Whoever spotted that one deserves a free upload token  

As someone who used to regularly exploit economies of all sorts on PC servers, I can't really conceptualize how there's a single bug that effects the economies of multiple different servers (including those using scripted currency systems using flags rather than the default "gralats," if Classic actually uses that), which apparently works in some way through manipulating the upload system. The fact that this already exists on several other servers would lead me believe that isn't an actual thing, and this seems to be happening as Classic now reaches out to developers from servers that already had the system.

I also can't wrap my brain around the idea of an "unfixable exploit," but I dunno. I do know some things on Graal can't be handled at a scripting level, but the uploading system is a scripted system meaning it should be able to be fixed through proper scripting. Maybe if this was an issue with the survey rewards offers or something like that then this would make sense to me, but even then I'd be pretty confident that a real fix could be made.

I think it was probably changed for the obvious reason, which is that it gates players into needing to buy gralat packs to afford hats and other cosmetics when they're released (instead of refunding their old uploads). If that is the case, I don't understand why it isn't being said and people are instead being told to come to the forums and make vague posts surrounding the change.  

Posted by Thallen

which is that it gates players into needing to buy gralat packs to afford hats and other cosmetics when they're released

You'll never get a cent out of me UNIMAX.

Unlike you people who buy your gralats, I refuse to spend my money on graal to buy hats and other cosmetics, especially when the hats are getting worse.
Whoever made that bloodhound hat should feel ashamed of themselves  

it might have been said somewhere but i wasnt looking hard enough: if i refund a 20k head, will i receive 20k tokens or 10k